Escalation of the war(S)?

[flume641]

Good overall plan and since the rebel/imperial battles and setup worked so well in SWG its not a bad way to extend it to Kami/Kara factions here in ryzom.
However, I do question the fact that both factions are supposed to be ulimately trying to restore Atys, even though their views on how to do so differ, won't this increased hostility between factions deter from that goal and weaken both sides in the event of a renewed kitin incursion?

*Looks odd on Dcrispo* who is talking SWG here, other than you? let them have some brawls , we are in a faction war here adding NPC bases and faction points can do wonders, and giveing PvErs some choice to add to it is also great.

[xfluffee]

I know I haven't been here long, and I wasn't around before PvP and factions, but it does seem like the whole -concept- of PvP on here is just broken. It really seems like someone looked at WoW and thought . o O ( they have millions of subscribers, and they do it *this* way, so if we to do the same thing, we will have millions of subscribers too! w00t! ). It doesn't work here, and it has just driven players off, making a small population even smaller.

The whole concept of PvP here should be scrapped and redesigned from scratch, perhaps with the exception of the PvP PR regions (which are GvG and Team vs Team). Yes, this includes scrapping the steaming pile of bodoc dung called outposts.

Kami and Karavan are "at war" with one another, so there is potential for conflict there. The lore indicated quite plainly that neither side had an advantage over the other. With our player population existing as a small subset of the entire homin life on Atys, something that seems to be (conveniently) forgotten at times, it is unlikely that WE can impact that to any great deal. Yet even with their conflicts with one another, they both had to unite to push back the Kitin. Maybe they did too good of a job.

The civilisations and tribes are at odds with each other at times, so there is potential for conflict there too. The civilisations seem to live in a state of strained peace wth one another, and it very likely wouldn't take much for them to be at each others' throats again. Some of the tribes are openly violent to each other and other civilisations (Ancient Dryads vs Matis, for example). Only the Kitin Threat serves to unite them. Well, if there was a Kitin Threat.

But in the end, everyone is supposed to come together to fight the Kitin, and at least according to the lore, everyone is supposed to be looking at the problem of the Goo.

The "Kitin Threat" needs to be real again. Give people something to unite around, instead of things to divide them. Let there be expeditions into the Deep Roots to find out hidden secrets of the Kitin. Let there be waves of Kitin patrols and attacks that lay waste to a city or two for a limited time. Let players see a small group of Kitin in the distance and actually think . o O ( is this all of them, or is this just an ambush? )

Then, when people are living under the constant threat of Kitin patrols and attacks, start to re-introduce outposts, but having them meaning what they are supposed to mean:

1. station established at a distance from the main body of an army to protect it from surprose attack
2. the body of troops stationed there; detachment or perimeter guard
3. an outlying settlement, installation, position, etc.

The concept of an "outpost" has meaning in connection with the civilisations, not factions, not guilds, not individuals. To the Kami, all of Atys is their home. To the Karavan, Atys seems to hold little permanent meaning. And for the groups and individual players, which of us, realistically, has ANY prayer of a chance to become "bigger" than one of the civilisations? Is that not what we're trying to do with outposts (regardless of what was intended when they were introduced) ... they have their cities, their zones, and we have ours?

Let outposts be the initial settlements of an expanding civilisation. Note, this doesn't happen in an hour, a day, or even a couple weeks. The Matis have all of their settlements in Majestic Garden, for example. The same goes for Trykers and Zorai. Only the Fyros seem spread out like one would think an expanding civilisation should be.

This can also be a way to (re?)introduce some meaning to citizenship with the various civilisations.

This will, by necessity, include PvP conflict. Perhaps one civilisation thinks an expanding civilisation is becoming too powerful, or maybe trying to expand into the territory of another civilisation. Or perhaps an enemy tribe is annoyed that expansion is happening too close to their territorial lands. This can be the basis of some missions for tribes or civilisations: attack a enemy settlement. Who knows, maybe even full-blown battles. But this is a way this game can strike off into an original direction, instead of playing copy-cat.

Again, all of this is my opinion and my perception of the game. But I think to extend the current way things are done is just self-defeating, because it's a fairly empty goal. There are already mindless PvP games. One of them has millions of subscribers and does this kind of thing a bit better than Ryzom.

According to the lore that -I- read, Ryzom is striving to be more than that.

[vguerin]

To the Kami, all of Atys is their home. To the Karavan, Atys seems to hold little permanent meaning.

You had me interested in reading til this... Everything becomes bodoc droppings when you mix the business of making our game better with propoganda.

[gillest]

- it does seem like the whole -concept- of PvP on here is just broken. It doesn't work here, and it has just driven players off, making a small population even smaller.

-The whole concept of PvP here should be scrapped and redesigned from scratch, perhaps with the exception of the PvP PR regions Yes, this includes scrapping the steaming pile of bodoc dung called outposts.

-Yet even with their conflicts with one another, they both had to unite to push back the Kitin. Maybe they did too good of a job.

-But in the end, everyone is supposed to come together to fight the Kitin, and at least according to the lore, everyone is supposed to be looking at the problem of the Goo.

-The "Kitin Threat" needs to be real again. city or t Give people something to unite around, instead of things to divide them.

-Then, when people are living under the constant threat of Kitin patrols and attacks, start to re-introduce outposts, but having them meaning what they are supposed to mean...


According to the lore that -I- read, Ryzom is striving to be more than that.

Bless you

Disclaimer: had to take a few things out but it doesnt meam I do not agree...

BTW, I am surprised you found a version of that game as a new player: that is the one I subscribed to nearly 3 years ago.

[meloner]

The whole concept of PvP here should be scrapped and redesigned from scratch, perhaps with the exception of the PvP PR regions (which are GvG and Team vs Team). Yes, this includes scrapping the steaming pile of bodoc dung called outposts.

QFE !

But in the end, everyone is supposed to come together to fight the Kitin, and at least according to the lore, everyone is supposed to be looking at the problem of the Goo.

QFE !

The "Kitin Threat" needs to be real again. Give people something to unite around, instead of things to divide them. Let there be expeditions into the Deep Roots to find out hidden secrets of the Kitin. Let there be waves of Kitin patrols and attacks that lay waste to a city or two for a limited time. Let players see a small group of Kitin in the distance and actually think . o O ( is this all of them, or is this just an ambush? )

QFE !

Then, when people are living under the constant threat of Kitin patrols and attacks, start to re-introduce outposts, but having them meaning what they are supposed to mean:

1. station established at a distance from the main body of an army to protect it from surprose attack
2. the body of troops stationed there; detachment or perimeter guard
3. an outlying settlement, installation, position, etc.

QFE ! IMO the OP's should belong to the governments and only guilds with the appropriate civilisation alliance can control them.

Let outposts be the initial settlements of an expanding civilisation. Note, this doesn't happen in an hour, a day, or even a couple weeks. The Matis have all of their settlements in Majestic Garden, for example. The same goes for Trykers and Zorai. Only the Fyros seem spread out like one would think an expanding civilisation should be.

This can also be a way to (re?)introduce some meaning to citizenship with the various civilisations.

This will, by necessity, include PvP conflict. Perhaps one civilisation thinks an expanding civilisation is becoming too powerful, or maybe trying to expand into the territory of another civilisation. Or perhaps an enemy tribe is annoyed that expansion is happening too close to their territorial lands. This can be the basis of some missions for tribes or civilisations: attack a enemy settlement. Who knows, maybe even full-blown battles.

hey man ! copy-paste all that and send a ticket ! spam them if you have to !

[jared96]

I know I haven't been here long, and I wasn't around before PvP and factions, but it does seem like the whole -concept- of PvP on here is just broken. It really seems like someone looked at WoW and thought . o O ( they have millions of subscribers, and they do it *this* way, so if we to do the same thing, we will have millions of subscribers too! w00t! ). It doesn't work here, and it has just driven players off, making a small population even smaller.

Well said, but Blizzard adapted....and they now have more PvE servers than PvP ones. They stemmed their exodus.

Kami and Karavan are "at war" with one another, so there is potential for conflict there. The lore indicated quite plainly that neither side had an advantage over the other.

That can exist for a while but player dynamics will change that. Most notably "who wants to join a lost cause ?" . Let's say I am a new player in game, I read about factions, I read about cats and OP mats .... hmm what side do I wanna join ? The side with 20 OP's or the side with 4 ?

But in the end, everyone is supposed to come together to fight the Kitin, and at least according to the lore, everyone is supposed to be looking at the problem of the Goo. The "Kitin Threat" needs to be real again. Give people something to unite around, instead of things to divide them. Let there be expeditions into the Deep Roots to find out hidden secrets of the Kitin. Let there be waves of Kitin patrols and attacks that lay waste to a city or two for a limited time. Let players see a small group of Kitin in the distance and actually think . o O ( is this all of them, or is this just an ambush? )

Yeay....let all the original promises and lore come true.

Let outposts be the initial settlements of an expanding civilisation. Note, this doesn't happen in an hour, a day, or even a couple weeks. The Matis have all of their settlements in Majestic Garden, for example. The same goes for Trykers and Zorai. Only the Fyros seem spread out like one would think an expanding civilisation should be.

Two quick and easy solutions.

A. PvE and PvP servers. A catch 22 ATM because of current server population. On one hand population can't support and on the other hand, more and more peeps leaving cause they ain't satisfied with current situation.

B. Open up the old "temple" lands to settlement. Let the logic be that the MakDuka nd Jena have little sway there as they are still are under lingering effects of the old gods. Before either god can hope to have any sway there, the area must be settled and cleared of kitin. So they both have a vested interest in getting peeps there but it takes their combined power to do so.

Have the OP's there get attacked by special kitin waves and make the homins effectiveness there somewhat curtailed by the reduced influence of the faction gods. For example reduce the effectiveness of non-native land spells by 50%. That is a fyros character could throw fire (or maybe fire / electric - the native kami land spells) at 100% effectiveness but the other racial spells at only 50% effectiveness in this zone. The reason for this is that "taking" and defending an OP from the kitin should be required to involve a concerted effort by reps from both factions.

1. It should give neutral players something equivalent to but not equal to current OP bennies.

2. Weapon OP mats for example could be similar to what we have now but boosts against homins would be reduced and boosts against mobs would be elevated.

3. Cats of course would be cats.

4. PvP oriented players are not excluded from the fun. But ownership of an old land OP would require the assent of both kara and kami players because it would be that much harder to take with only 1 side showing up for the battle.

5. Since it's a 250 zone, we couldn't have a new preponderance of 250 OP's so output would have to be modifed to produce a a range of produce from 50-250 rather than all 250's.

6. A mechanism must be in place to prevent making these an extension of current OP's. If it just means more OP's to be owned by factioned guilds, the effort is wasted.

[jared96]

All well and good but what did it have to do with the original post?
Make a new thread for discussion about neutral/factioned.
Or even better, il do it for you.

Classic....since this homin genocide is religion based, I'll use the old biblical quote about "let he who is without sin throw the first stone". I don't have enough fingers to count the number of neutral oriented threads you've hijacked and often managed to get closed. You owed me this one . But by way of explanation.

1. My response was not directed to a statement by you, it was directed to the one I quoted. If you have a beef, take it up with the peep I quoted.

2. As I said I have no objection to you running around and bashing each other in the head. But a) you are asking for development time and that has an impact on all of us and b) despite 18 months of PvP oriented development activity, server population is still dropping. When all the neutral players are driven out of game and the server population is insufficient to "keep the lights on", how much head bashing you gonna do then ?

It ALL should be about making the game survive, and the biggest threat to that at this point is a true PvE option. I welcome you having more PvP options, but from many peeps point of view, you had your turn, it's someone else's turn now. Let themn have soemthing and then it will be your turn again.

[tigrus]

Still, i didnt tell you NOT to include neutrals or PvE'rs.


I told you to bring the DISCUSSION WETHER OR NOT NEUTRALS IS A FACTION AND SHOULD BE INGAME AND BELONG HERE, to a different thread. Because it is 100% off topic.


How about trying to get a point now will you? its not that hard..

[d29565]

Okay, sorry Sunce...but, since when can you really tell anyone what to do and wherever? You could ask very nicely..that might be better.

[zanthar]

Okay, sorry Sunce...but, since when can you really tell anyone what to do and wherever? You could ask very nicely..that might be better.

*nods in agreement*