Crafting in workshops and in teams

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frakel
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Crafting in workshops and in teams

Post by frakel »

Some thoughts on crafting in teams

Historically here on Earth crafts as woodcarving, weaving, jewelry making, armouring etc. has been skills passed on from master to apprentice. The apprentice learning from the guidance of a master with many years of experience, the master benefitting from having a skilled assistant to help in his own creations.

For the homins of Atys crafting is a tough individual struggle – every single crafter having to learn the skills of his trade without ever benefitting from working with a more experienced colleague or master. In this regard the crafting skill in Ryzom stands alone compared to the skills of fighting, magic and foraging, since these skills allow players to work together in teams.

Through teamwork players will typically find that they gain experience faster compaired to going solo. This is especially true for the least experienced players in a group, who will benefit greatly from the increased XP-haul their more experienced teammates are able to produce. Thus teamwork is a great way for the experienced to help new players gain a foothold in the game. In addition teamwork is one of the things that make for an interesting gameexperience as well as great opportunities for socializing and RP if you are so inclined.

Only the crafters have to go it alone...



Workshops as the places for teamwork

What we need in the game is an option for the crafters to allow them to cooperate. I see no need to modify the crafting skill as such, nor is there any reason to hinder the crafters out there who would still prefer to work on their own.

My suggestion would be to introduce workshops to the game. These should be located in the cities (the forge in Pyr being one obvious candidate), since being a home to craftmen is what cities are all about. By entering a workshop (and thus having acces to specialied tools, a workbench, heating sources, proper lighting etc.) crafters will be at an advantage compared to crafting in a dark, damp and dangerous corner of the prime roots for instance. This advantage might take the form of allowing two homins to work together on the same crafting project.

When in a workshop, two players should be allowed to perform crafting actions together. One would act as master, choosing the actual crafting action, spending materials and gaining the finished product as usual. The other player would act as the assistant, his skill in the relevant craft providing a bonus to the succesrate of the master. Both would share XP for the action, just like a forager and careplanner.

Obviously if a master of skill level 250 and an apprentice of skill level 50 are crafting together, the master should gain a larger bonus to his succesrate by making q100 items, than if he choose to make q250 items. The later being too complicated for the assistant for him to be of much help in the process.



Other possible benefits of workshops

- Creating another dapper zink
The use of workshops could require a fee in dappers, the amount depending on the attempted quality of the item being crafted. Since workshops might be particular popular for high-end crafters trying to counter too many item degrades by working in pairs, a healthy dapper fee for high-end items might help drain some of those superfluous dappers out of the economy.

- Warehousing
Players could be allowed to rent storage space near/in the workshop, since this is where they might be using a lot of raw materials. This would be another dapper zink, and might actually allow those Mehktoubs of ours to be something more than immobile storage space ;) . That being said, a stable near the workshop would be nice as well - thus allowing the crafters easy transport of materials and finished goods.

- Wokshops as meeting places
As it is now, buyers and sellers of items make posts on the forums when searching for a deal. By having workshops you now have an ingame location where one could count on many crafters of varying levels to hang out (read: grind). A buyer looking for a special item could then go to the workshop and ask there for a potential seller.

In addition crafters of different levels would have a location to search each other out for helping each other in the crafting actions. Masters could apply for apprentices, friendships could be formed, rivalries between masters cried out to the public... All sorts of great opportunities for socializing and RP would be found.

_____________________________

Consider this suggestion a work in progress... Offer some constructive feedback and I will incoporate it into the package ;)
Then the rest is up to the developers...
Last edited by frakel on Tue Jan 23, 2007 9:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
ashling
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Re: Crafting in workshops and in teams

Post by ashling »

Is making crafting more teambased a good idea? Some people do alot of crafting when waiting for friends to be on to team hunt with.
mithur
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Re: Crafting in workshops and in teams

Post by mithur »

AFAIK, as it is now, you can grind craft fast enough; the limit is the matrerials you can get, so is heavily attached to Harvest.

I, personally, spend harvesting 1 hour or so, and 10 mins crafting. At much, I can spend 2h harvest to get 2 full meks, and then 20 mins crafting, but no more (No place for more mats), so that crafting workshop will be an empy place most of the time.

The idea, per se, is good, but I think it doesn't worth the amount of work needed, and there aren't enough population for it working well.
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neuze
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Re: Crafting in workshops and in teams

Post by neuze »

i like the idea very much
gratz
jamela
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Re: Crafting in workshops and in teams

Post by jamela »

Interesting thoughts. To a degree, crafting is already a team activity in that the materials may be gathered by more than one person, particularly in the case of finished items involving supremes and boss quarter, when looking for the best recipe. The various stables have long been sociable meeting places for crafters, and as a consequence, everyone else, though much less so now than before the high level town teleports were restricted.

The idea of a careplanner equivalent is excellent, and though I find myself resistant to the idea of a workshop, Pyr forge is an outstanding example of one which already exists. I'm not keen on the idea of increasing item stats beyond the capabilities of the materials, although outpost items do this already, but what crafters have been crying out for for a long time, is a way to increase their success rate, and this is what I think your suggestions should influence.
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rushin
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Re: Crafting in workshops and in teams

Post by rushin »

think thats a very good post indeed :)

As jamela mentioned i am not so keen on altering the stats of items - the recipes for very good gear are complex and very hard to fulfill, i think they do a good job as is.

Increasing success rate is probably a bug bear of every crafter, there is nothing so depressing as getting 4 degrades in a row on your 100% boss mat craft. Another nice touch would be reduced focus costs while crafting there.

The forge would make a great location. With a little dev time it could be made an attractive place: stables, warehouse where you could store your mats for a price, merchants, and not essential but maybe good to encourage more people a faction independent tp.
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kekulus
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Re: Crafting in workshops and in teams

Post by kekulus »

I like the idea, and this is even tied to my cry of despair that crafting is not allowed from Apartment inventory. From a role-play standpoint, my character feels like the apartment is a much more desirable place to craft than say, in the sand in front of the stables, and especially more than on a ledge cowering under a pack of kinchers, but as it now stands the game encourages the crafting-in-the-sand-at-the-stables route.

If that makes sense, i can't find it. I would really like to see the ability to craft from room inventory implemented. I'm just speculating, but in my heart i feel like it would be an easy change...?

Now you have suggested taking it to the next level - if crafting in the apt was better than a dark corner of the PR, then how much better would it be in a shop with REAL tools! I'm not really sure it should improve the quality per se, but it ABSOLUTELY should make it easier to craft to your current abilities without screwing something up - which, by the way, i WOULD expect to see if i were crafting in some dark corner of the PR (how much could i concentrate on my skill when i know full well that something might take a bite out of me at any moment?).

We might all be picking nits here, but overall it is a neat idea, and it gets my vote!
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naratuul
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Re: Crafting in workshops and in teams

Post by naratuul »

rushin wrote:think thats a very good post indeed :)

As jamela mentioned i am not so keen on altering the stats of items - the recipes for very good gear are complex and very hard to fulfill, i think they do a good job as is.

Increasing success rate is probably a bug bear of every crafter, there is nothing so depressing as getting 4 degrades in a row on your 100% boss mat craft. Another nice touch would be reduced focus costs while crafting there.

The forge would make a great location. With a little dev time it could be made an attractive place: stables, warehouse where you could store your mats for a price, merchants, and not essential but maybe good to encourage more people a faction independent tp.
I like these ideas a lot. Warehousing is a great idea and could serve as a useful dapper sink. I think that an overall change of the crafting system is NOT warranted, but these ideas you have mentioned are a great start. Jamela brought up great points too. I'd be happy with new plans, color options and fixing the horrible sucess rates at Master XXX Crafter, because its inconcievable that a Master would have more degrades on a q250 item than a 245 crafter, but it happens :/
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nolie101
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Re: Crafting in workshops and in teams

Post by nolie101 »

I think this was a very good idea on how to incorporate crafting with teams. As said before, crafting tends to be bound to harvester, thus making crafting the only skill in the game that's _really_ dependent on other skills to succeed. One way to deal with that, could indeed be using a master / apprentice relationship.
Quesam /Arispotle/ Riders on the Storm
frakel
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Re: Crafting in workshops and in teams

Post by frakel »

Taking your feedback into consideration I have now remowed the idea of allowing workshops to affect item stats. The idea of warehousing has been included instead ;)
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