Ryzom

Thing is, and I admit that it is a real problem, we do have an abundance of multi lvl 250 players, which in a way defeats what the system was originally intended for.
I.E. making it possible for players that have one or two skills higher than others, to level with those who do not have that.
Or in other words, for me to form a team with folks who would use lower level skills, at the same time using my own low level skills. (I´m glad I still have those, but over time I will "loose" them too.)
Assuring a higher survivability, as a high-level could normally somehow safe the day in a pinch, and assuring equal XP for all in the team.
Which isn´t really possible anymore. Due to lack of new players.

This "overhang" of high level players now sadly leaves a void where this should be possible.
As only very few new players keep coming to the game, that logically are to small in level to make teaming up useful.
And are too far between to effectively team up amongst themselves.

Saying that we, as old players, are too arrogant to team up with newbes is simply wrong in most cases. Many of us can´t anymore. It doesn´t work.

That´s the downside of an otherwise cool system.
It worked when there was a relatively steady influx of newbes, back then.
But today, well... it has crippled itself.

Some do love to level fast and some do love to level "slow".
That´s just the way it is. The Catalyzers have augmented this behavior even more and made it a true problem in my eyes.
For, as it is sadly known, many players that do like to level and grind, only "mash the buttons" and don´t bother to learn how to really "use the system".
The Stanza system creates so many possibilities, of which only 10% are used by players. For they are perceived as "useless" or "not efficient" enough.
If people would bother to try certain things themselves, instead of just asking for "the best way to level", it would certainly be otherwise.
Such as it is, many folks just burn through the levels, reach 250 and declare everyone else "useless", because THEY are not able to level with anyone of a lower level anymore.
Sad

Healers are in a particular clinch here. Once they´ve reached 250 they are accused of "nerfing the XP" in a Team and aren´t asked to team up anymore.
Because to many of the newly arrived people levels are all that matters.
And that, to me, is a very, very sad thing.

Anyway, to each his/her own.

CU
Acridiel

ishark wrote:... The first (ok, maybe second) thing I was told when I arrived here is that level is irrelevant, you can be q250 and still suck at the game, so I don't understand why people link "level" with "knowing how to play". Or, to put it differently, why leveling with cats is a problem? If someone wants to learn how the game works, cats or no cats he'll learn, if he doesn't he won't.

Level to a large degree is irrelevant. It may come as a suprise that I have no masters at all, some very close yes, but no 250. Yet I've killed every boss, solo treked every corner of Atys and much more, I know almost every node in PR and times, have a note book full of recipes for gear. I even managed to get my name in 2nd place in fighting for the Tryker Karavan temple. Since returning what I'm finding is this. Some players who are used to other MMOs, have a mind set that you must be top level, that the leveling inbetween is somehow an inconvenience to get out of the way. I'm of the view an excess of cats just reinforces that mind set. Distracting them from a wider view of the game, rather than sitting in one spot with a packer full of cats charging to 250.

It's nothing to do with wanting to slow players up and making them 'suffer' as much as the old timers, more that the old times know that like speed reading a book to the end, you have missed some important details.

Back on the subject of rasing the cap, I have no problem with it, if it comes with a sizable PvE patch, new things to dig or craft maybe, something new. Rasing the cap just to raise the cap seems pointless.

acridiel wrote: This "overhang" of high level players now sadly leaves a void where this should be possible.

Aye, which just strengthens the argument for more skill trees over widening the void even further me thinks...

ajsuk wrote:Aye, which just strengthens the argument for more skill trees over widening the void even further me thinks...

Agreed
*and hell now has frozen over*

And I absolutely agree with Dmarxs too.

CU
Acridiel
(who has no 250 too)

ishark wrote: On the other side, with the central role played by crafting, a new player feels useless. I've heard many times that it's false, but let me tell you that reaching q100 jewelcrafting only to see someone in universe giving away for free q170 jewels REALLY makes you wonder why you bother raising the skill. In particular, when level-raising is a completely uninteresting activity (click a button). Thats when I stopped leveling JC the 1st time.

There's a degree of truth here. It could be many reasons, but I feel the lack of economy and that some skills start out too hard, then get way too easy. Mainly, digging. I've always been of the view it's too slow at first then is just too easy. I can dig so much so fast that the what I'm digging has no value. I can fill up a room in short order, I know someone in my old guild that had over 4 guild halls on alts for space for mats. The digging, crafting which is basiclly the grounding of the economy has always needed to be reviewed.

ishark wrote: Another side-effect which I'm starting to see is that since everyone has access to all skills, there's a flattening of characters. Paradoxycally, this is the opposite of what the multi-branched level system was supposed to do. But in reality, the consequence is that all healers heal the same, all mages have the same spells, all diggers have the same stanzas.

Healing and magic can get a bit samey certainly, but all using the same digging stanzas? No, step digging, kill digging and many others that people use.

ishark wrote: What is the "wider view of the game"? Of the things you mention, three (trekking, knowing nodes, recipes) are solo activities, boss killing I've been involved in twice. In both cases it was tank'n'spank, and I just spammed my highest heal from start to end (and I won't mention that it was healing for 1/10 of the other player's, not something to make me feel useful).

Maybe my view on what is the wider game is a little different, from others. I'll try explain.
Few weeks ago I'm digging in Loira. A Kirosta starts eating an Arma. I messaged a Homin digging who was really near that they needed to move. They said no it's far enoguh away, and normaly it would be, but what they failed to realise is that between that Kirosta and them were a bunch of gittery Wombais who were in range.
After that kirosta was finished I knew because of the way the Kirosta shuffled sideways slightly the wombais would be next. The Wombais would scatter and the only direction was right towards the digger, Kirosta on spotting the Homin would forget about the Wombais as Homin is far tastier. And that's what happened. maybe it's just me, but this kind of thing for me is a wider view.

Good sneaking needs this wider view. Some mobs have different ranges. Looking at the way the mobs are in front of your path and knowing that Vorax is going to attack that poor lumper in a second and fear it right into your empty path.

ishark wrote:
BTW a thread on the subject would be very welcome, but I've been surprised at how reserved people are when it comes to digging and (even more) recipes.

In no way surprised here.
Why give anyone for free, what has taken you month if not years to find out?
That´s not how the world works. *shrug*


And even while I´m absolutely no person who likes to to puzzle over recipes, I´m trying to do my best finding them out by myself.
Because I don´t like to be spoon-fed either.
So I have to swallow the bitter pill and keep puzzling.
Because I want to be proud, to have done it by myself!

Wish anyone would do that.
And I´m damn glad no-one has yet gotten to the stupid idea of making the best recipes public. (At least as far as I know.)
Yes, I think that would be extremely stupid. So, sue me.

CU
Acridiel