The long post.

[jackmor]

This is a strange game. Like all the rest of them, you can't win. There is no winning the the game. But, in other games of this type you can win somthing wether it be a grand prize at the end of a long quest or the ablity to enter an area without being attacked, you could win somthing at some point. In this game there is almost none of that.

Ive played other games for days, weeks, or even months trying to win some part of them. Making first attempts then finding out what was needed to progress farther. Going off to level or search for what I needed then comming back and trying again. In some cases the objective was handed to me. In others I set the goal for myself. Winning the game itself would never happen because the game had no end.

In this way these games are unlike traditional games that are a competition against another person or people. You win or lose when the game is over. In these types of games you compete against the game itself or in essence you are in competition with yourself.

This game is like preparing for some event that is not scheduled. You repeat the same actions over and over trying to make your position in the game stronger. Preparing yourself for somthing that is going to come next. But, there is no somthing next. And, there is no indication of exacticaly what your preparing for. In this game the reward is always the same, Exp level and fame. But, that in itself in meaningless unless it is for the porpose of winning some larger part of the game.

There are attacks from the computor on you or those around you. There are battles you can fight without provication. But there is no reward or prize for winning. This is success without progression.

Every thing a person does in life is reward based. Beit large or small, instant or delayed there is aways a reward. It is why we do anything. In all cases the reward is the chemicals the brain releases when we do somthing. And that makes us feel good about what we've done. The easiest examples of this are eating and sex. When you perform these actions you are rewarded with a cocktail of chemicals that make you feel very good. This is a simplistic explaination but none the less true. Ask anyone you see playing a slot machine, sky diveing, riding roller coasters, playing cards or any of a number of things that seem to have no practical value, why they do it and they will all have the same reason. Its fun. It makes them feel good.

When you beleive that youve won somthing it makes you feel good. But, you have to feel as if youve won somthing first. There must be some sence of accomplishment. Somthing that tells you your winning. This game is not providing that over the long term. And I am begining to wonder why Im playing.

There doesn't seem to be any real plan here. What are we getting ready for? Where is this game going? Right now we'er going round and round with no destination. That is why there are so many posts asking for story line and content. We want to feel like we'er accomplishing somthing and its not enough to just build our charactor without purpose. If we kill a boss mob or build up our fame. It has to be for more than the act itself. If we get together and kill a boss, change the game to reflect that. If we kill an npc let there be some change or for that matter let us kill guards and fight our way into a city. If there are destroyed strongholds let us hire or recruit npc's to rebuild and gaurd them while we'er off line. If we are supposed to reclaim this world tell us how and make that possible. If we are supposed to build our lands up and be dominant in the world then tell us how we are to do that.

Lets just do somthing even if its wronge. At least it will be somthing.

[bizango]

I tend to look at these games a bit different than how you describe what motivates you. I don't see this game as a competition that must be won. I see it more like participating in an epic saga which is still in the writing.

This is a story that is only beginning, the character I sponsor in the story is of course the leading character as far as I'm concerned , so of course I must do heroic and meaningful things or it isn't really a story worth paying attention to. This early in the story, there isn't much going on because we are all still trying to become competent enough to do the big stuff later. So we practice killing things, crafting, harvesting and exploring.

Now, I'll admit, part of that saga is accomplishing some things, like finally being able to travel to other lands without fear of being eaten by kinchers. Accomplishments like this do provide some satisfaction but to me they aren't central to the purpose of being here.

As to your plea for more content (quests, etc) Patch 2 Part 3 is coming in January.

[lostt99]

Lets just do somthing even if its wronge. At least it will be somthing.

Although i have uninstalled and cancelled (cpu can't handle it and i don't have time/money for a beta) i think your questions come from the same points you made. And i think that your fretting is spurred by the lack of implemented ingame content (which supposedly is coming in the next 2 patches?). I'd agree that the storyline needs to be made more apparent to the player and the community, strengthened plotwise and publicitywise, and show impacts in the game world, server, race relations, etc from actions in game. i think that this will all come in time though which some people may not be patient enough to wait for. i think that this game has the potential to be a game that takes nearly ALL aspects of life and transposes them into a fictitious environment where players have freewill to do almost any and everything, to the benefit or detriment of theirselves, their race, their faction, deity, political alignment, whatever. it pays so much attention to detail that if it went in depth anymore it would become too much of a burden to play...in some aspects that is. the ones it currently lacks i'm sure are already in the works. all this i think relays back into your statement:

And I am begining to wonder why Im playing.

there is soo much that they can do with this game, on every different aspect of life, that i think it frustrates some that there's not much they can really do ingame besides grind...

-regret

[neofuzz]

I think you seek some form of in-game self gratification for objectives/goals accomplished... well it's true you won't see much of that in Ryzom at the moment. Hopefully when new features are fully implemented those who feel similarly to yourself will be somewhat more content with their time in Atys.

[zonoli]

I've been thinking this same thing over the past week or so. So far the biggest thing I've looked forward to is seeing if harvest is still possible after server resets, or if it's a kincher nest. Forage, fight, craft what you get from them. Raising levels only to be able to raise higher levels. While it's not boring, it does seem like grinding*20 skill trees, and that can get boring fast. How many ocyx do I want to fight? What is the goal of casting Stun a few thousand times?

What exactly is coming? What is in store that is not PvP related? Race trips are fun, but not content. The Karavan vs. Kami events are a nice change of pace, when they occur, and when you can catch them. New haircuts? Thanks, but that seemed like putting a hubcap on a tractor. It seems we are ready for a change and a goal - not the ability to play dressup all day.

I'm not at all flaming, bashing, ranting, or degrading the game. I am truely asking, what is going on? I've seen no mention of checks/balances for PvP. Will it be possible for a level 210 Pikesman engage a level 50 harvester at random? Is the main game content going to be PvP? Are events going to be random based on player actions, or scheduled for Friday nights. The current system of skills is what other games lack. I love the idea of all-in-one characters, that's why I gained interest in SoR. Does SoR have the skill/merchant/fame/no race penatly system, but lack the game to go on top of it?

What are outposts bringing to the game? I see mentions around ryzom.com that they are coming, but what is coming? Will it be a guild vs guild (PvP) control issue? Or a daily back and forth struggle between whoever is logged in vs kitins? If the ultimate goal is a PvP game, with grinding mobs in between, please just say so, as I'd rather move on now. If the goal is truely a server wide battle against the kitin, but it has 6-12 months to develop, please just say so, as then I can judge if I'd rather check back in a year. I would like to base a decision on whether to stay or leave based off of some Nevrax feedback. I've read the same websites that most players have seen. I see a LOT of conflicting and untrue stuff already, but untrue can mean unimplemented. Without information or positive change, at this point I think I'll ride out the month I've paid for, and, just go back to a game that's not still in beta.

[lyrah68]

I personally get alot out of testing out which material goes best with what other material to break the previously thought of magic barrier of *insert gear stat here*.

I will admit that trying to get around agros ATM is a royal pain in the sore back end. NOTHING fun about sitting in ONE place (that you can't hunt OR forage in) for *insert insane amount of time WELL over one hour in length but under seven hours...here* and not be able to get by due to pathing just **not*** moving mobs out of agro range.

Been there done that (took me three days to get from Dyron to Thesos to Yrkranis, most of that time was between Thesos and Yrkransi, when a group was coming from Yrkranis I helped them get to the spawn spot...dying in the process. They then helped me get to the PR spawn (first spaw spot that NON Matis can get). I can't TELL you how elated I was at their kindness, when I told them that...they said "Funny, we feel the same way about your death to help us find the tunnel" (thing is, I had a maxed DP, so what was ONE more death to me...other than loading wait time. I won SO much more than that by just being helpful).

To me, playing ANY game I find people. I enjoy meeting the WILDLY divergent kinds of people you meet in a game. I have met Christian evagalists, and Pagan priestesses (yes, went to her website and saw more than enough to believe her), atheists and everywhere in between. I have had some truly mentally stimulating conversations. I love that part of the game, or any game.

Without PEOPLE, any game is just a pile of meaningless CODING.

[trosky]

You are right that compared to other mmorpg, this game is less rewarding. You dont get cool new weapons or armors from quest, or killing named mobs. However I disagree with you on a few points :

You are preparing for something, well I am. I want to defend my guild's outpost. To help the Karavan by exterminating the kami lovers , to participate in the events.

I dont look at reward the same way you do. As you've said, the feeling of accomplishment is a chemical reaction in the brain, but you can get that reaction from playing a game. Its only a matter of perception. If you set yourself goals for your character, when you'll complete those goals you will have the same feeling of accomplishement (the same chemical reaction), you will feel good .

I got to agree that when you get higher in lvl, getting a new skill, a new weapon or a new armor tends to get repetitive so it gets less rewarding. With the new and upcomming content you can get the feeling of accomplsihment from PvPing, im sure the winners of the Matis Gladiator Brawl got that feeling, you can also get it from taking over an outpost or defending yours and for killing named mobs.

Even in real life, some people will get the feeling of accomplishement from small well done tasks, others will need to save a life to feel they have accomplished something.

If you are seriously bored and want to start any kind of event, im sure lots of players will be willing to help.

[jackmor]

You are right that compared to other mmorpg, this game is less rewarding. You dont get cool new weapons or armors from quest, or killing named mobs. However I disagree with you on a few points :

You are preparing for something, well I am. I want to defend my guild's outpost. To help the Karavan by exterminating the kami lovers , to participate in the events.

I dont look at reward the same way you do. As you've said, the feeling of accomplishment is a chemical reaction in the brain, but you can get that reaction from playing a game. Its only a matter of perception. If you set yourself goals for your character, when you'll complete those goals you will have the same feeling of accomplishement (the same chemical reaction), you will feel good .

I got to agree that when you get higher in lvl, getting a new skill, a new weapon or a new armor tends to get repetitive so it gets less rewarding. With the new and upcomming content you can get the feeling of accomplsihment from PvPing, im sure the winners of the Matis Gladiator Brawl got that feeling, you can also get it from taking over an outpost or defending yours and for killing named mobs.

Even in real life, some people will get the feeling of accomplishement from small well done tasks, others will need to save a life to feel they have accomplished something.

If you are seriously bored and want to start any kind of event, im sure lots of players will be willing to help.

Yes I know what your talking about. And if you don't know who I am I understand your points. Ive been playing since the game hit the shelves. I have reached levels in all my skills that allow me almost complete freedom. I belong to a Great guild of people, Eye of Atys, who are very supportive. We have been getting ready for the changes to come. I have traveled the lands and have ports to all lands. I have partisipated in mob boss raids and, events. I guess your right Im getting bored. But what are you talking about outposts WHAT outposts. There are none as far as I know. Are there some coming because THAT would be somthing. please don't say those ruins you can't interact with. Yes we would love to get together with you for an event please contact our ambassidor and event organizer (IG Fryos) Aussie. If you can't find him contact any of the Eye of Atys. Krae is almost always on and is a High officer. He will pass you message on.

Ps: As far as the brain thing go's it was just a background fact to make my point of what makes fun. I didn't want to get to much into it or digress.

[borguk]

And this is why Im not renewing on Dec 31st, they have been so slow in bringing us haircuts that outposts at a guess are at least 3 months off and since they tell us nothing how are we to know.

Ive enjoyed my time here and hope to again when the game is at it should have been at release, outposts, guild wars, kami v karavan, objective to levelling your character that is not for the sake of levelling.

Dont get me wrong I like this game for the following reasons, its not linear you can go and do what you like when you like and in the first month with the pops so high and concentrated around the main cities I really enjoyed it.

The ex-focus beta testers without realising it ruined the game by running off between races and entering the prime roots in the first few days i.e. using their pre-release knowledge to get themselves an advantage over those of us who came at release, this brought about a backlash from Nevrax in the form of patch 1, which lets face it decimated the population.

Anyway when the content is all there I will be back, which will be more fun than getting it in drips and drabs over the next few months.

[zumwalt]

Understand, that for the first 6 months of the games life in a live environment, they will go through balance / rebalance of the game.

This games dynamics are not something that can be built on a whim.
They have achieved so much more with this game than any live MMO to date, period.

Sure, anyone (including myself) can program an equivelant to a first person shooter mmo game, throw in a few trade skills, and wala, rpg online.

To have a possibility of a living storyline?

That is dynamics I have never seen, and this engine shows proof that it can be done.

As players we learn how to adjust, the maps are not getting larger, and the proof that things are changing is evident on a daily basis.

Turn off your computer, go outside, look at your gas station across the street, then go to the grocery store, check out the prices there, its all dynamic.

Can you write the president and complain about gas? Sure, do you think he is listening? How about food, complain that a gallon of milk went from 1.25 a gallon to 3.29 a gallon.

Ryzom is based on choices, right now you have a few limited choices, that is CHANGING, I pay to play the game because I support the efforts of a company with true vision.

If I can ever figure out how to get a solid copy of the open source LeN without having to download 1 file at a time (like 1 huge RPM of the thing would rock), I would play around with the dynamics of the back core engine myself.

As it stands all I can use is engines like SecurePlay, TrueVision3d, and Quazal to do development in, then I use tools such as 3d Studio Max, Adobe Photoshop, and junk.

You have to understand that they have to, in a very limited timeframe, produce what the box advertises, or they will fall under a legal clause of false advertisement.

I don't think they are waiting around for that.

So what is missing, will exists shortly, based on statue of limitations for advertised products in the USA.

I don't know about international laws.

The real thing is, the game IS fun, because us players get involved.
When I log in, and I want to spend time harvesting to make items to sell, I grab my packer and head out.

If I want to craft and not harvest, I buy player harvested mats.
If I want to fight, I get in groups and we go fight.

Same with missions, I can choose to do them or not.
Lets atleast give them the benefit of the doubt, and let them get all 3 major patches in place, and see what we have.