Frustration and Disappointment

[raynes]

This weekend some of my guild mates took part in the event and completed it. The reward for taking part in this event was a new title and a major boost in fame in several of the factions. One guild mate went from a 25 in Kami fame to 90. When I heard this I was so angry, frustrated, and disappointed that I had to stop playing and go do something else until I cooled off. I was so angry in fact that my initial reaction was to cancel my account all together.

You see since day one I have been working on my fame levels. It takes a lot of tedious task running to reach high to max fame with them. So for the past two months that is what I have been doing. Just this past weekend I managed to reach 92 with them. I was proud of my accomplishment. I did lots of work and obtained something that I thought would be only obtained through many, many hours of work. Then I heard about the results of the event.

In one night my guild mate had accomplished what it took me 2 months to do. So now I have all this time invested into building something up that can be accomplished simply by taking part in an event. I feel as if the developers of this game gave me a big middle finger and had a laugh. My hard work was for nothing and in the end it’s not going to make the least bit of difference that I did 100’s of ridiculously boring and absurdly tedious tasks.

My guild mate made the comment that the event only gave him fame in the main races, not any of the tribes so therefore my hard work wasn’t for nothing. My response to that was to ask what is stopping them from having an event that hands out Icon Worshipper fame like candy or Shadow Runner fame like it’s nothing. By handing out fame like nothing, you have cheapened the fame system and the fame value. No longer is it hard and long work to become friendly with groups in game, it’s just a matter of doing events.

To make matters worse is the fact that he got a title for doing the event. I have max fame and I can’t even get them to say or do squat. Yes I understand completing the event was an accomplishment and he does deserve the title. But on that same note shouldn’t someone with a high fame level get something, anything? Especially if they have spent a lot of time doing stupid tasks. . I mean hell I couldn’t even keep the title of Kami Ally with 90+ fame. (Which BTW was a total slap in the face. I look one day I have a title that would make sense for someone with a high fame level. The next day it’s taken away. The reason… “People have titles they didn’t earn and shouldn’t have”. I have worked my butt off to get high fame with them and I don’t deserve to be called an ally?)

What is going to happen with future content? Is there going to be perks for those who work to get fame to 100 global? What about 100 personal? Or are players going to be able to earn massive amounts of fame in events thus making doing those stupid tasks pointless. (Which by the way I am still waiting for a developer to come in game and show me how the hell I can deliver something to someone when I have no clue where they are. Or how I can harvest for something when there is no clue as to where to find it).

At this point my disappointment and frustration with this game is at an all time high. I am left asking myself why I should even bother doing tasks for fame, or hell why I should even bother with fame at all. It’s obvious that there is no reward for doing lots of hard tedious work and it’s obvious that the developers intend to let people change their fame with the flip of a hat. My support for the devs and the makers of this game has taken a huge nosedive with this. I mean how am I suppose to get excited and encourage others to try this game if my work and time invested mean nothing?

[marct]

...One guild mate went from a 25 in Kami fame to 90. ... You see since day one I have been working on my fame levels. It takes a lot of tedious task running to reach high to max fame with them. So for the past two months that is what I have been doing. Just this past weekend I managed to reach 92 with them. I was proud of my accomplishment. I did lots of work and obtained something that I thought would be only obtained through many, many hours of work. Then I heard about the results of the event.

In one night my guild mate had accomplished what it took me 2 months to do. So now I have all this time invested into building something up that can be accomplished simply by taking part in an event. ... My hard work was for nothing and in the end it’s not going to make the least bit of difference that I did 100’s of ridiculously boring and absurdly tedious tasks. ... By handing out fame like nothing, you have cheapened the fame system and the fame value. No longer is it hard and long work to become friendly with groups in game, it’s just a matter of doing events. ... I mean how am I suppose to get excited and encourage others to try this game if my work and time invested mean nothing?

I am only going to speak to the fame point, It would seem that the fame system should take these things into consideration, and decay or erode fame based on "accumulation method", regularity of assitance, etc. So that if your guild mate does not help out some more his fame starts to drop, if he goes another day or two it starts to drop faster, etc. Also, since it was a one time event, it should erode faster. People forget one-time events quickly where as someone who visits repeatedly has a face and a reputation. In fact you should have multiple tasks available that you cannot get unless you have earned your fame in a certain manner. They should come to him/her for similar assitance as they performed in the past. Kind of like, "You did this for me before would you be interested in helping with this?"

I would also see that the decay rate should be based on calendar days, and logged on time. You should decay from both perspectives, and it should not be obvious why you are decaying.

There are many benefits to your fame, and I would expect to see more and different benefits for you based on what you have done for the tribe.

Your title concerns are a different issue, and I would expect that your other benefits maybe outweight this. Maybe his title should decay if he does not Ally and defend again soon?

On your unachievable task item, It is a community talk to people. A loner often doesn't do well. I would like to see interaction with NPC's on this level as well. You should be able to ask an NPC if they know of someone or something. And you could get different responses based on fame, race, etc and the NPC's knowledge. They could even direct you somewhere else. "Well I do know someone in District 5 that has mentioned that persons name before." Or "I have seen many a harvester return from The rising with a sack full of ..." Or " Have you tried looking for a Frippo, they love the taste of Dung Resin. "


Just some thoughts and perspective, I don't have any idea what plans are... and I'm also kind of new so everything with a grain of salt.


marc. in game "Noinossalg"

P.S. I agree with the awful repetitive none interesting tasks for missions. How about some multi player, timed missions. You must be in a group to get the mission, and you have to do a couple of things. Maybe you need to harvest mats, and make a weapon from those within your group and within the time."

[raynes]

I REALLY REALLY like your idea of adding a component to fame that makes it decay over time. It would certainly make sure those how have worked on fame over a long period of time have an advantage over those who get a burst in one night. It makes perfect sense too. If I am doing errands for a tribe on a daily basis, they would certainly recognize me and treat me better than someone who took part in a battle once sometime ago.

Post this in the post patch 1 wish list!

[kisedd]

I feel your pain. I do. I see this happen in mmo's so often I want to cry. My first game was AC and I spent 2 years to get up to level 90 or so. I was proud of my work. In game changes eventually made leveling quite easy and people were getting to 90 in weeks. There are countless examples of cheapening peoples hard work in many of these games.

The fame system in game is at best incomplete. There are no real rewards for having high global or personal fame. I have also worked hard to build up my fame in several areas. I don't see any rewards for my services. Negative fame seems to have some minor penalties. I can't do business with any merchant of a faction I have negative fame with.

I know that guild missions and other activities aren't in the game yet, and I'm sure that all plays to fame.

The other question I ask myself are what rewards can you give to players for completing various events. Fame does seem a logical choice. My reaction is they went overboard in the reward. Perhaps they should have given 20 pts of fame for completion. Rigth now however, if you have 10 Kami fame or 100, what does it matter. My heart tells me all is not done yet. The players got some titles, what rewards should players get? Cool loot or some kind maybe.

The decaying fame idea sounds good in theory. Except I don't play every day. I have work and I"m out of town serveral days a week. Do I loose a lot of fame because I had RL commitments? Once you make a player run around trying to maintain fame with various factions every day when they log in, that sounds more like work than fun.

How big was the battles that we fought. How greatful should the Kami be. There are many RL examples of battles fought in the past that garner great respect. Many battles from WWII are well remembered some 60 years after they were fought. We rememember battles from hundreds of years in our past and honor the men and women who made sacrifices on our behalf.

I watched an episode of Navy NCIS last night that was about a WWII Medal of Honor winner. What that man did in a few hours on a beach during that battle, I in my entire life of working hard will never be able to come close to. Sometimes a moment in time is worth a thousand lifetimes.

[angus858]

Hang in there Raynes. If you are a very active player (and I'm sure you are) you will have many chances to gain fame from events.

In my opinion fame should come primarily from events as it does in real life.
Q: Who was the first man on the moon?
A: Niel Armstrong
Q: How many times did ge go?
A: Once (I think)
Q: How many people worked their tails off day after day for ten years to put Armstrong up there?
A: Thousands, and most folks can't name a single one of them.

Fame isn't fair. In addition to hard work it requires being in the right place at the right time. If you put more work (time) into the game than me you will have more skills, more knowledge, more dapper, and better gear than me. But fame is different. Nobody can count on fame. I think I could be a better actor than Keanu Reeves but I'm not upset by his fame. I can sing better than certain famous rock singers too but you'll never see my face on Rolling Stone. That's the way the world works. Ryzom seems to work this way too and I'm ok with that.

[zumwalt]

I also feal your pain, although I took part in the Karavan's scripted event, other than satisfaction that I spent countless hours like everyone else trying to solve it, I got absolutely nothing.

What you stated about what they gained has me sadly disappointed, the reward should have just been the fun of joining the event.

What I took away from the event was the knowledge that they are trying to make the game a better place for everyone.

Now that I know they rewarded a few people, and not everyone who worked the events this has me greatly troubled.

1) Karavan event was broke. Nuff said there, we did it per the script to a T, and nothing happened according to the script.

2) Rewarding some but not all who attend the events, is just blatently wrong in every aspect, and discourages people from doing any other events.

Have the event, enjoy the event, do not reward a select few when tons of people attended and helped in the event.

[Lukati]

Hang in there Raynes. If you are a very active player (and I'm sure you are) you will have many chances to gain fame from events.

In my opinion fame should come primarily from events as it does in real life.
Q: Who was the first man on the moon?
A: Niel Armstrong
Q: How many times did ge go?
A: Once (I think)
Q: How many people worked their tails off day after day for ten years to put Armstrong up there?
A: Thousands, and most folks can't name a single one of them.

Fame isn't fair. In addition to hard work it requires being in the right place at the right time. If you put more work (time) into the game than me you will have more skills, more knowledge, more dapper, and better gear than me. But fame is different. Nobody can count on fame. I think I could be a better actor than Keanu Reeves but I'm not upset by his fame. I can sing better than certain famous rock singers too but you'll never see my face on Rolling Stone. That's the way the world works. Ryzom seems to work this way too and I'm ok with that.

That's practically a revelation right there!

[tetra]

It takes a lot of tedious task running to reach high to max fame with them.

I don't know the fedex guy, the pizza delivery guy, my mailman, or even the lady I sometimes hand my rent check to in the leasing office either... Most folks don't either.

[raynes]

I don't know the fedex guy, the pizza delivery guy, my mailman, or even the lady I sometimes hand my rent check to in the leasing office either... Most folks don't either.

Do you have the same pizza guy delivery you pizza everynight? Have you had that same guy delivery you pizza every night for the past two months? If you did I can gaurentee you would know him buy his first name, offer him really good tips, and treat him in a way that you wouldn't treat other people. That is what doing tasks to get fame is in this game.

Hang in there Raynes. If you are a very active player (and I'm sure you are) you will have many chances to gain fame from events.

In my opinion fame should come primarily from events as it does in real life.
Q: Who was the first man on the moon?
A: Niel Armstrong
Q: How many times did ge go?
A: Once (I think)
Q: How many people worked their tails off day after day for ten years to put Armstrong up there?
A: Thousands, and most folks can't name a single one of them.

Fame isn't fair. In addition to hard work it requires being in the right place at the right time. If you put more work (time) into the game than me you will have more skills, more knowledge, more dapper, and better gear than me. But fame is different. Nobody can count on fame. I think I could be a better actor than Keanu Reeves but I'm not upset by his fame. I can sing better than certain famous rock singers too but you'll never see my face on Rolling Stone. That's the way the world works. Ryzom seems to work this way too and I'm ok with that.

It's not the same thing. Fame is based upon how well you are known in the game. If you are going to a tribes camp every day, doing tasks for them, you will be much more known than say a war hero they have read about. Why? Because day after day you are interacting with them, helping them. They should treat you as their own.

Take the pizza boy example above. Who would you know better, Papa John or the Pizza Boy that brings you pizza everynight?

[gralen]

If you are going to a tribes camp every day, doing tasks for them, you will be much more known than say a war hero they have read about.

You're forgetting that the war hero you're so blithely dismissing just SAVED their lives by helping defeat a terrible invader. This is not some history lesson, this is happening now. You're also forgetting that this "no-name" war hero answered the call of the Kami, proved his undying (by being willing to die) loyalty to the Kami and was rewarded for that effort. Of course the war hero is going to gain the fame and respect of the Kami and the Homins who, for whatever reason, did not step up to the task will not gain that fame and respect.

Also, don't forget that you yourself acknowledge these warriors as heros and no matter how much I love pizza, the delivery boy is no hero.