A few observations. Perhaps (should the snow in hell have turned into a maior ice age) I am not the only one who thinks like this.
Weapons are more important than armor in combat.
Heavy armor will get more important with patch 1 due to the increase in mob damage. But a weapon will still be more important. Attacking a mob without weapon is certain death, if you do it without armor you will only probably die.
And light and to an extend medium will become insignificant. Without dodging light armor is reduced to a more expansive and more easily destroyable jewel and med armor will be too ineffective compared to heavy armor.
As result
People are willing to pay more per mat for weapons than armor
I would estimate around 3-4 times more per mat in weapons as they are willing to invest per mat in armor.
Alltogether this isn't as bad, exept the huge nerf of dodging. A middle way, with a heavy armor where you can only rarely dodge and a light armor with a good doging chance would be a better solution.
What is buggering me is that in spite weaponcrafting being a more important and therefore more profitable crafting branch armor crafting has all the disadvantages.
- You need more mats to build a armor. This is logical - a armor simply needs more mats than a weapon, simple question of volume. But it's not really good in the way of gamebalance.
- You need more time to lvl armorcrafting. At lvl 101 the armorcrafting trees split into 6 or 5 branches. Weaponcrafting is splitting into 4. Two of these weapons have the same type of damage (sword & axes), so you can scratch on of them. Crushing damage is AFAIK only needed for full damage against plants, which are usually not a regular target, so that can be scratched as well.
In short, you have 2 essential weapontrees (slashing and piercing) vs 6 essential heavy armor trees (7 if you include shield crafting). Or, for mages, 1 essential weapon tree vs 5 essential light armor trees.
Is this splitting into the single items really necessary for armor? Or for jewels, for that matter. Those split into the single items at lvl 51 already and are for the most part bloody tnedious to lvl. Which stands in NO relation to their benefit.
Armor/jewelcrafting vs weaponcrafting post lvl 100
Armor/jewelcrafting vs weaponcrafting post lvl 100
RUN
[size=-1]Silverion, while being last person alive in the party[/size]
[size=-1]Silverion, while being last person alive in the party[/size]
Re: Armor/jewelcrafting vs weaponcrafting post lvl 100
If your thinking in terms of longevity of the game, splitting trees allows for more high end crafters. Specialists in armor pieces. So you can have a dozen maxed out crafters in 1 item, instead of 1 maxed out crafter that makes 12 items.
Works great in guilds. Take your crafters, and split the pieces up. Much faster than trying to supply 1 crafter with 1/2 million mats to level all the skills needed. especially since that poor crafter would probably burn out after a few months. Instead you can have crafters and crafter/harvesters who can work on 1 skill, level quicker and supply the guild sooner with higher q items.
I figure.. that the time spent to feed 1 crafter to supply a whole guild could be better used supplying multiple crafters, who also solo harvest and craft when not being supplied. So... as a guild/group you will out level a guild fed crafter. That, and you will have a more diverse guild craft wise.
I don't see why everyone is trying to max all skills.. Seems like a seriously warped form of self inflicted torture..
Works great in guilds. Take your crafters, and split the pieces up. Much faster than trying to supply 1 crafter with 1/2 million mats to level all the skills needed. especially since that poor crafter would probably burn out after a few months. Instead you can have crafters and crafter/harvesters who can work on 1 skill, level quicker and supply the guild sooner with higher q items.
I figure.. that the time spent to feed 1 crafter to supply a whole guild could be better used supplying multiple crafters, who also solo harvest and craft when not being supplied. So... as a guild/group you will out level a guild fed crafter. That, and you will have a more diverse guild craft wise.
I don't see why everyone is trying to max all skills.. Seems like a seriously warped form of self inflicted torture..
Re: Armor/jewelcrafting vs weaponcrafting post lvl 100
*iceskates to work*
i think the idear was to have people specilising in one or two items, wich is kinda silly really so i pretty much agree with you, it should just stay as heavy-medum-light-shild trees
i think the idear was to have people specilising in one or two items, wich is kinda silly really so i pretty much agree with you, it should just stay as heavy-medum-light-shild trees
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It's Prttey fnuny how we can raed tihs einrte snetnece wtih all tehse ltters all out of palce, and we can cnotniue to keep raednig and sitll mekas snece of waht we are raeding. No mttar how mnay tmies you raed tihs oevr and oevr you can sitll mkae snece of it.
How is taht pssoible?
It's Prttey fnuny how we can raed tihs einrte snetnece wtih all tehse ltters all out of palce, and we can cnotniue to keep raednig and sitll mekas snece of waht we are raeding. No mttar how mnay tmies you raed tihs oevr and oevr you can sitll mkae snece of it.
How is taht pssoible?
Re: Armor/jewelcrafting vs weaponcrafting post lvl 100
If you are only worried about XP, this is true. However, Armor craft is armor craft, it doesnt' change to 'boot/gloves/legs/vest/arms/helmet' craft. a 250 light glove crafter can craft 250 armor, any kind (other than shield). Now, the chances arn't very high, but it can be done. Thus, unless you are worried about levels, no, you don't HAVE to be that high. The same is true of weapons. Melee craft is melee craft. I may have a higher % to succeed at making a sword rather than a long mace, but I can still make them the same QL. Same line of thought holds for Jewelcrafting and ranged.shrike wrote:In short, you have 2 essential weapontrees (slashing and piercing) vs 6 essential heavy armor trees (7 if you include shield crafting). Or, for mages, 1 essential weapon tree vs 5 essential light armor trees.
aside from that... in a 'proper' group, those in heavy armor really should be the only ones getting hit. They are the tanks after all, and are there to soak up and deal out damage. That's their job. The mages in the light armor shouldn't be getting attacked, their job is to keep the tanks healed and deal damage. Those in medium armor are there to take a hit or two for the mages if they need to, or help in a bad pull, but arn't intended to take the brunt of the damage.
As for the rest, not sure it'll pan out like that.. we'll see on wednesday.
Re: Armor/jewelcrafting vs weaponcrafting post lvl 100
rodrigoq wrote:If your thinking in terms of longevity of the game, splitting trees allows for more high end crafters. Specialists in armor pieces. So you can have a dozen maxed out crafters in 1 item, instead of 1 maxed out crafter that makes 12 items.
Works great in guilds. Take your crafters, and split the pieces up. Much faster than trying to supply 1 crafter with 1/2 million mats to level all the skills needed. especially since that poor crafter would probably burn out after a few months. Instead you can have crafters and crafter/harvesters who can work on 1 skill, level quicker and supply the guild sooner with higher q items.
I figure.. that the time spent to feed 1 crafter to supply a whole guild could be better used supplying multiple crafters, who also solo harvest and craft when not being supplied. So... as a guild/group you will out level a guild fed crafter. That, and you will have a more diverse guild craft wise.
I don't see why everyone is trying to max all skills.. Seems like a seriously warped form of self inflicted torture..
You know its funny, I tried to tell my guild this, and they told me that why did it matter to me what one machoistic crafter wanted to do crafting all 6 branches of armor instead of specializing in one. Here I am telling them that it may allow us to get to all the pieces faster and there they are telling me its none of my business.
Korin - Tryker - Retired
125 2h pierce melee, 105 2h slash melee, 91 lake forage, 55 forest forage, 55 desert forage, 61 prime roots forage, 91 heavy armor craft, 55 light armor craft, 58 medium armor craft, 62 2h melee craft, 52 1h melee craft.
125 2h pierce melee, 105 2h slash melee, 91 lake forage, 55 forest forage, 55 desert forage, 61 prime roots forage, 91 heavy armor craft, 55 light armor craft, 58 medium armor craft, 62 2h melee craft, 52 1h melee craft.
Re: Armor/jewelcrafting vs weaponcrafting post lvl 100
Yes, you are theoretically able to make all other armor pieces at q250 when you have only lvled one as high.
But really only in theory. For example, making a q150 long sword with a long sword skill of 102 has a success chance of 5%. This is not very practical. And this are only 40 lvls. With 140 (q250 vs lvl 101) you will probably be lvl 150-200 from all the degrades before you finally made your first q250.
Also, while splitting it up works, it doesn't changes the fact that you need to invest like 3-4 times the amount of mats to lvl up the armor you need than you have to invest to lvl up the weapons you need.
But really only in theory. For example, making a q150 long sword with a long sword skill of 102 has a success chance of 5%. This is not very practical. And this are only 40 lvls. With 140 (q250 vs lvl 101) you will probably be lvl 150-200 from all the degrades before you finally made your first q250.
Also, while splitting it up works, it doesn't changes the fact that you need to invest like 3-4 times the amount of mats to lvl up the armor you need than you have to invest to lvl up the weapons you need.
RUN
[size=-1]Silverion, while being last person alive in the party[/size]
[size=-1]Silverion, while being last person alive in the party[/size]
Re: Armor/jewelcrafting vs weaponcrafting post lvl 100
I love these Troll posts. I see now where all your "make up your own stories" posts come from.mikwana wrote:A 250 light glove crafter can craft 250 armor, any kind (other than shield). Now, the chances arn't very high, but it can be done. Thus, unless you are worried about levels, no, you don't HAVE to be that high.
No, you cannot realistically craft anything but the tree you level up in from level 101+ on. Go spend some time leveling and try.
Re: Armor/jewelcrafting vs weaponcrafting post lvl 100
machoistic crafter
I want that as a title
Im one of those ones who wants to level up all six trees in armour craft (mainly cant see one of six people being interested enough to grind away gloves really - ooo the excitement of saying "wow, im lvl 150 in glove craft"), but not at a burn out rate, im taking it slowly, crafting when i have enough mats on me, and enjoying the other aspects of the game in the meantime.
Sure it will take a long long time, but hey, if theres anything in this game, its time.
I want that as a title
Im one of those ones who wants to level up all six trees in armour craft (mainly cant see one of six people being interested enough to grind away gloves really - ooo the excitement of saying "wow, im lvl 150 in glove craft"), but not at a burn out rate, im taking it slowly, crafting when i have enough mats on me, and enjoying the other aspects of the game in the meantime.
Sure it will take a long long time, but hey, if theres anything in this game, its time.
Last edited by martinr on Wed Nov 03, 2004 11:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Armor/jewelcrafting vs weaponcrafting post lvl 100
shrike wrote:
Also, while splitting it up works, it doesn't changes the fact that you need to invest like 3-4 times the amount of mats to lvl up the armor you need than you have to invest to lvl up the weapons you need.
Not arguing this.. from what Ive read about the harvest changes on ATS.. mats are going to be hell to aquire in mass quantities. I'm preparing for the changes.. mentally and pysically.. Not really, but I'm trying to accept that my dirtnap/mat ratio will increase significantly.
I'd rather Ryzom slows down now leveling wise, during the first 2-3 months than a major overhaul 2-3 years down the road.