A good excuse for Agro Draging.

[dlixus]

Today I submitted my first harassment ticket. Apparently it will be the first of many because it happens that the guild I joined isn’t liked by many. And because I’m a member of said guild I’m therefore “Public Enemy.”

First let me start with saying that I’m not trying to start any wars, or flames, I simply want to discuss something that happened to me and why I think such behavior is inexcusable no matter what guild one is in.

I’ve been in this game only a few months. Some of you may already know me as Dlixus, or Dlixius, but none know me as Cuca. None of the guilds I joined know my alts until now. Why I’m making this public, well because my perception of the game has changed. When I first came here my goal was to join an RP guild, and although I intended to play my first character as the main character, those goals have changed...I created Cuca and found a good guild, they are active, mature, funny, helpful, and over all there is no in-guild drama. The drama apparently comes from those outside the guild.

Now in all honesty I don’t know much about the guild’s history or any Ryzom guild for that matter. I’ve only been with them 3 days. Before I joined Cuca to Nexus I encounter other players who tried to recruit me from Silan. One of them even followed me to FH where he tried to play it off as coincidence. Shortly after I told him I had joined a guild he stopped talking to me. I found this behavior odd at first though I’m starting to understand it now. Another PM me saying how shock he was that I picked Nexus, then he continue to talk bad about the guild, and boasted about his guild and how they are the best and yada, yada, yada…

To be honest I found his behavior immature and the only thing I got out of that player was that he was jealous of Nexus. Furthermore, when I saw this player and I said hello they completely ignored me. Not that it matters, because to me someone who quickly stereotypes and excludes players in an OOC manner like that has some serious personal issues. But just to bring up the next point.

When Darmina recruited me all she said to me was: we are a mature guild of players, asked me my age, asked where I lived, and gave me the option to join and leave if I found the guild not to my liking. There was no bad talk about other guilds, no saying don’t go Karavan, and absolutely no boasting about the guild. I’m still neutral as a matter of fact.

Today while killing some brains in KoD a guilder and I were dragged agro upon. Now I know that Ryzom is full of tough agro and this can happen by accident. But when you drag a named unto two people who are hunting, give no warning, and then not rez them -that is harassment. There is no excuse for it.

Two players came to where I was hunting. One of them asked what levels we were. Foolish me, I though he wanted to join team. When I revealed my stats he laughed and then commented I should be hunting somewhere else. Shortly after that he and his teammate dragged Jinbai unto us. Of course I was hit being the lowest in my team. When I said he should rez us there was no answered. When I called him out on the attacked he simply said “Learned from your guild doing it to us in PR.”

Now some facts: My highest level is 53, anything that looks at me in PR kills me. I was not there when he said agro was pulled on to him. As far as I know KoD is not a PvP zone, PR is. If what he said is true then he should do what I did. Take pictures of the incident, and report it, because such behavior as far as I know is frowned upon by anyone in Ryzom. Above all, it is against the CoC.

On a personal note, judging me for something others did says more about the idiot who attacked me than it does of the guild I joined. The only reason I was attacked was because he knew I was low level. If he wanted to PvP so bad all he had to do was flag up, or go into the PvP zones. This was plain and simple PK. I honestly hope the CSR who reads this post and gets my ticket do something about it because I don’t think this player will stop harassing me.

You who is reading this, what is your opinion? Were his actions justified?

[iceaxe68]

You who is reading this, what is your opinion? Were his actions justified?

Since I have only one side of the story I won't offer any opinion on this particular incident.

I will say that sometimes people act like idiots about unimportant things, and do harm to others that is undeserved. I do consider harassment to be harm, regardless of the "virtual" nature of the activity.

I would be highly embarrassed if anyone from my guild acted as you have described. I'd want proof, of course, and I'd give both sides a fair listen, but I do not consider harassment to be justified in any situation, ever, and it might well lead to ejection from the guild.

Thank you for keeping the name(s) and guild private. Such situations are best resolved without undue publicity.

However, some people who engage in harassment would enjoy even anonymous publicity of this nature, so this sort of post can be a bit of unintended encouragement to them. Best to keep it in official channels, or perhaps at most take it up respectfully with officers of the individual's guild.

I hope you have a better day tomorrow, and best wishes on your continued advancement and enjoyment.

[minirushin]

its never pretty when it happens, but however much we want it not to be the case *every* game has its share of idiots.. Hopefully you can shrug it off and move on

btw do ticket it if it happens again, take screen shots of abusive chats etc. the CSR care, and will do something about it

[dlixus]

I do have prove and screen shots of the incident. Clearly by his remark his attacked was intentional and planned. Not only that, but when the first one failed in his attempt, the other one went and pulled the named agro again. I my self don't know if what he said happened to him actually did. What I do know is that I was not responsible for any of it and neither was my guilder who is also low level. But Sasi brings up important points and now I feel like an idiot for posting about this on the forum. If a moderator reads this and considers the subject inapropiate please delete this post. My intention is to open a discussion about the incident, not to make things worst by encouraging more bad behavior.

[sidusar]

Ah, your post raises some age-old questions about responsibility.

What I do know is that I was not responsible for any of it and neither was my guilder who is also low level.

For one, is a person solely responsible for their own direct actions, or is there such a thing as group responsibility? Assuming one member of a guild engages in despicable behavior, can then not also the guild's leaders be held responsible for keeping that person in the guild and not doing anything to stop them? And can then not every member of that guild be held partly responsible because, just by being in that guild, they support the leaders?

Replace 'guild' with any group, and it's a question that holds many lawmakers in RL busy. IMO it's grossly oversimplified to hold the entire group responsible for the actions of a few members, but just as oversimplified to say the actions of other groupmembers have completely nothing to do with you at all.

Apparently it will be the first of many because it happens that the guild I joined isn’t liked by many.

Then secondly, there's the question of how far a person is responsible if they put themselves at risk. If you join a guild that is very involved in PvP, you know you're going to get flack. Nothing against PvP, but it's a simple truth that it attracts this kind of behavior.

This is analogous to the "if you go into a PvP zone, it's your own fault if someone kills you" argument. Or in RL, "if you don't lock your bike, it's your own fault if it gets stolen", "if you go into a dark alley, it's your own fault if you get mugged", etc etc. IMO that's a load of nonsense (dangerous nonsense at that) and it's still fully the responsibility of the person who did it. But fact remains you could've expected it.

I simply want to discuss something that happened to me and why I think such behavior is inexcusable no matter what guild one is in.

But anyways, intentional aggro-dragging is just wrong. Always. Period. Done. Nothing to discuss there. The above subjects are much more interesting discussion material.

[fiach]

Sorry to hear what happened to you mate, Nexus are a quality guild, I was proud to be a member and proud to still have them as great friends in Ryzom

I think I know the guild that dragged on you (no name and shame here either), but I would be surprised if their leader would condone such an act, be interesting to see how this is resolved.

On a ligher note, there are tossers in every MMO, luckily Ryzom has very few of them.

[kalindra]

Misbehaviour and breach of CoC is generally frowned upon by the community in general. I doubt any guild leader would like to have trouble makers in their ranks as the image of the guild itself can get tarnished by the acts of one or a select few and all the others, even the most "innocent" (newbies) ones can get affected by it. I have seen many examples of it and it does apply, no matter how unfair it is. When you wear a guild tag, you are representing your guild, even if you don't have a rank. People might not remember your name when you do something, but they will probably remember your guild tag.

As mentionned on our guild presentation page, whoever in our guild, if found guilty of such behaviour, will be dealt with internally.

Did I ever say that I hate politics ?

P.S. It's PvP's fault.

[dlixus]

P.S. It's PvP's fault.

You nailed it.

Forget about the incident. I already regret posting about it here. What the hell was I thinking?

Lets talk about important things, like the upcoming halloween event...

[tigrus]

Okay, lets be clear about it:

1: The members who did it was members of The Exodus Syndicate, *MY* members, the members who got trained is from neXus.

2: We *DO NOT* condone aggro dragging.

3: In this case, the members has been told aggro dragging is generally not accepted, and that aggro dragging should never be done, even as a punishment for trash talk.

Public statement - We do not trash talk, nor drag aggro. This was a one time accident, and here's the reason for it.

[seb94]

Next time sunce put the start of conversation plz it's easy to show only the part you want to show us.

On an other side aggro dragging is forbiden, so if you or your members have a problem cause nexus kill you in pvp zone, don't go in pvp zone and explain them that the best pvper on server is scary to go in pvp zone

So if your guildies do it again to one of my guildies, i can tell you that we can really be more pain than we are and only with allowed things so plz explain few things to your guildies

thx