ATS: Weight and stamina changes

[calel]

Lol, sneaky, editing your post before I could hit reply.

Seeing it in the bigger picture, 2handed weapons will always be the heavy hitters in melee, 1handed weapons will be either the 'tank'/defender or mage disruptors for dualwielding. Increasing the damage output for 1handed axes and maces may actually make 1handed fighters shine in their own field instead of getting constantly replaced by the 2handed fighters in your regular hunting party.

If the 1h revamp will go ahead and stays consistent with the other changes of the 2handed weapons, then spear will see it's theoretical damage drop as pike saw it. Considering spear is a 1handed weapon it will most likely not benefit from having a different reach over it's other 1handed peers. But that's not it's benefit.

I'm still convinced we're going towards more specific roles for each weapon, which imo can only be aplauded as it makes melee way more interesting. Each weapon has it's strengths and weaknesses, it's specific role and beneficial circumstances. Some may claim certain weapons will get (or are already) useless, I say they'll become different.

Afterall, you and I both know how 'useless' pistols seem to be, right?

[jared96]

It wouldn't. Unlike other fighters, decent pike users only need to worry about the parry of their opponents. That's the big asset pike and spear have over other weapons.

Would you elaborate for us non PvP'ers plz ?

[great83]

Would you elaborate for us non PvP'ers plz ?

What i got from it is that a pike user isnt in parry. Noticed how the other post about weapons i mention pikes as a "2-hander weapon killer"... what is the weakness of a heavy axe/sword/mace ... adv dodge is positive... While pikes have a min/max of -10 - +10 for dodge skill. So about 90% of the time a pike user in dodge has a higher value of avoidance then being parry after you counter in the adv parry mod of other weapons.

Edit: i agree with you here Kyerna, but i also like to think most weapons had a good use already just not everyone could see them

[jared96]

>What i got from it is that a pike user isnt in parry. Noticed how the other post about weapons i mention pikes as a "2-hander weapon killer"... what is the weakness of a heavy axe/sword/mace<

Again, I haven't met any mobs using a 2h weapon so what is the significance for us non PvP'ers ?

>While pikes have a min/max of -10 - +10 for dodge skill. So about 90% of the time a pike user in dodge has a higher value of avoidance then being parry<

I don't follow. A 250 player puts on a set of HA which adds no dodge and up to +3 parry for 268. A 1h spear user does the same and and adds a shield which adds +30 or +40 which puts parry at 308 not including the weapon. So starting there, a pike would have to have 18 more dodge modifier than net parry for being in dodge mode to be effective. A spear would have to have 58 more dodge than net parry before dodge mod would pass total parry.

> after you counter in the adv parry mod of other weapons<

Counter....with what ? Not sure if you talking about inherent properties of the weapon or "attack after" skills.

[raven41]

hmm, I think maybe what was meant, is that pikes have ignore armour, so it doesn't matter what kind of armour the enemy has (LA/MA/HA) or what its stats are, other then Parry (or dodge) .. could be wrong I just woke up

[great83]

Average parry of a pike user 269 (250 base + 12 heavy armour + 7 weapon)... now take this pike user and put him against a heavy axe user that has a adv parry of -16. That 269 parry becomes 253 parry for the pike user against that heavy axe men.

Now lets look at the same pike user in dodge. They have 257 dodge (250 base +7 weapon), when they go against the heavy axemen that has a adv dodge of +2 their dodge will be 259 against that axe user.

So you tell me what you would use... 253 parry or 259 dodge in this fight?

Side note: The pike has become a ******* weapon with very few uses... and currently i cant think of a single reason why someone would want to use it in PvE... sorry to say that.

[forever]

So your telling me that my one 250 melee skill(Pike) has no use.
Thanks Devs.

[great83]

So your telling me that my one 250 melee skill(Pike) has no use.
Thanks Devs.

Has some use for pvp but very little, just the damage reduction on the weapon hurt it in my eyes... atm it has 7 or 8 more dps then spear while you get the high parry of having a shield equipped. The only strong benefit i have seen for it is the dodge mod on the weapon being negative 10 to positive 10.

[jared96]

Average parry of a pike user 269 (250 base + 12 heavy armour + 7 weapon)... now take this pike user and put him against a heavy axe user that has a adv parry of -16. That 269 parry becomes 253 parry for the pike user against that heavy axe men.

Now lets look at the same pike user in dodge. They have 257 dodge (250 base +7 weapon), when they go against the heavy axemen that has a adv dodge of +2 their dodge will be 259 against that axe user.

So you tell me what you would use... 253 parry or 259 dodge in this fight?

Non issue for me....I don't PvP. But it seems a wash for me (250 base + 18 HA + 7 weapon - 16 adv parry = 259 also) ... using aen.....263 parry.

Side note: The pike has become a ******* weapon with very few uses... and currently i cant think of a single reason why someone would want to use it in PvE... sorry to say that.

1. Some Mobs (i.e. cuttlers) resist slash.
2. Pike is more healer friendly as tank takes less damage
3. No wepon can match pike's ability to hold muliple mobs

Of course 3 is the big one. Still I think the 20% nerf on pikes was too excessive. Yeah it could be argued that the 20% disadvantage is made up by the 10% speed increase and the 10% damage reduction.....but ignore armor is hell of a lot less useful in PvE than say bleed.

[sidusar]

but ignore armor is hell of a lot less useful in PvE than say bleed.

Depends entirely on the situation. Slashing weapons are better against creatures than have no protection from slashing. But pike in PvE is the only melee weapon that can be effective against any creature. If you're up against a creature that only takes half piercing damage, you can use ignore armor to still do full damage.

Axe users up against a creature that only takes half slashing damage, can use bleeding to do more damage, but it'll be less effective and cost more than ignore armor. It also takes a while to work while pike's damage would be instant.

Ignore armor really shines against creatures that take even less than half damage from melee, but that group only includes kipucka, kinrey, kidinak and vorax. Not creatures we fight often.