Escalation of the war(S)?

[zanthar]

That being said, as a Karavaneer I really like the sound of everything else and the more active role a factioned player could take in the world: equipping the guards, storming the strongholds... all very cool stuff. Everything suggested so far, though, would easily keep the developers busy for the next, oh, 3 years or so , and in that time I don't think the neutrals would see anything even close to this in which they could participate (yes, I am "moaning" , remember that neutrals are just as important a part of our playerbase as everyone else, and we honestly can't afford to push anyone away from the game).

How about civilization camps as well, that you don't even need to be race-aligned to support? After all, would a civilization really refuse someone's help just because they aren't a citizen? Of course those that are declared would reap some greater benefits, but I would personally love to see a Fyros-supported expedition traveling into the roots to unveil the mystery of the dragon, a Matis force searching for artifacts of their lost kingdom... you get the idea. This devotion to discovery could all be very beneficial for the development of the Saga rather than the back-and-forth factional slaughter.

I totally agree with you that no one should be left out and if the devs were to start on this they also need to include content for neutrals too with comperable rewards to factioned and neutral players alike! No loot drops please! But, the way I'm seeing the neutrals stand point is they want to take part in faction content,please correct me if I'm wrong, with out being apart of a recognized faction! Which can't happen with the current game mechanics at least IMO! And as far as content goes there will always be a little more content for factioned players, that's the way it is in any other game that has factions. Well I'm off for the weekend! Happy Eater all!

[tigrus]

A lot of the ideas in the original post are really appealing, but to start off I'd like to question one:



These things are pretty helpful in PvE situations, I agree, but making them available anytime would allow for some possibly annoying PvP situations. For reference, check out this thread for the discussion of "healing potions" and some good points as to why they should stay out of Ryzom. Perhaps a solution would be to disallow their use when one's outpost or PvP-active flags are present.

That being said, as a Karavaneer I really like the sound of everything else and the more active role a factioned player could take in the world: equipping the guards, storming the strongholds... all very cool stuff. Everything suggested so far, though, would easily keep the developers busy for the next, oh, 3 years or so , and in that time I don't think the neutrals would see anything even close to this in which they could participate (yes, I am "moaning" , remember that neutrals are just as important a part of our playerbase as everyone else, and we honestly can't afford to push anyone away from the game).

How about civilization camps as well, that you don't even need to be race-aligned to support? After all, would a civilization really refuse someone's help just because they aren't a citizen? Of course those that are declared would reap some greater benefits, but I would personally love to see a Fyros-supported expedition traveling into the roots to unveil the mystery of the dragon, a Matis force searching for artifacts of their lost kingdom... you get the idea. This devotion to discovery could all be very beneficial for the development of the Saga rather than the back-and-forth factional slaughter.

Well mate, there are those that have them eggs... *RAISES HAND*
And trust me, If i wanted to those would give me a massively unfair advantage in duels.. Its more fair we all have them.

[setstyle]

Well mate, there are those that have them eggs... *RAISES HAND*
And trust me, If i wanted to those would give me a massively unfair advantage in duels.. Its more fair we all have them.

I have them as well. The point is, though, that any implementation of these eggs as they currently function, even an availability for everyone, will never be truly "fair." The eggs provide an edge in combat independent of any trained skill, crafted items, and so on; combat, therefore, would be influenced more by the amount of eggs one has in his inventory rather than the skills he has developed, a system which I feel entirely defeats the purpose of PvP. Another solution, of course, could be a timer to prevent rapid consuming, but until then the eggs are inherently unbalancing. I don't mean to come off as complaining, but I wouldn't want the devs to waste time on something silly and ultimately a mistake.

Well I'm off for the weekend! Happy Eater all!

Happy Easter.

[mrshad]

The plan of faction NPC camps that will give honor pints if you kill them is a fun one. Having these camps in a PvP zone, or requiring people to be PvP tagged is not a bad idea either. I kinda think it would be fun.

The rewards can be varied...i don't particualrly like helaing potions...but, what do i know...they might be fun. Flowers, cats, OP mats...wonder mats, kitin larvea...there is all sorta of stuff already on existing vendors near the temple that can be given out.

Bunkers that need to be crafted would also be fun. Now..this is sounding a lot like EP2...which most of us did not like. The reason EP2 sucked was because our efforts ment nearly nothing. The Devs had there fingers on theevent the whole time. Tone down the amount required to build, and just let the players do it, and it might be fun.

We still have the PvP vs PvE arguments, as well as what to do with the neutrals. There are a number of nuetral players I really like, and I talk to them quite a bit. Still, in an FvF war...you kinda hafta choose an F. As fars as PvE content goes...I think we could make the crafting a completely PvP free zone...and realistically, if there are a number of different NPC camps in the different zones across Atys, it seems more likely than not that you could avoid PvP encounters (there just aren't that many players).

Equiping patrol units, like that kitin invasion way back when would be a really fun device.

We could use the existing NPC camps and a lot of the triggers and rewards that we have seen in earlier events. One thing I think we should avoid is teleporting off into a 'new' part of Atys for this story to unfold....i always sorta hated that.

This wouldnt significantly impact the way the game is currently played, it seems like it can be made so that any level of character can participate. It can be set up so that every major skill tree is used. PvP could be there for those who dig it, it could be avoided for those that don't.

Seems like a good idea, SunCe.

[jared96]

But then again that also takes away stuff, such as why would you fight for something you dont believe in, why should you be rewarded with honour, when your betraying both sides.

Cause there's more than 2 sides.

[jared96]

I conscede that point to you, but then those mulit-beliefs need to have their own factions, if they wish to take part in this kind of conflict. To be truely neutral means that you abstain from conflict.

Homin versus Kitin is conflict.

[jared96]

HOLD ON HERE!!

For the most part a large percentage of the Ryzom population is PvE'ers

More have left than remain but I guess driving them out completely is a goal of sorts.

Lets not try to turn Ryzom into some PvP based game and I'm sure (hope) the devs see this too. There are far too many PvP based games online already, Ryzom is a breath of fresh air with some optional pvP and lots of PvE in a player run economy not plagued with uber drops/loot.

Even [insert name of mmorpg w/ 7 million subscribers whose name may not be mentioned] now has more PvE servers than PvP ones.....new games are coming out without PvP which can only mean someone sees a market there. The markets need NOT be mutually exclusive.

I have no issues with bands of PvP'ers runninga round smacking each other but geez the lore is centered around the conflict with kitins. To give more and more bennies for homins smackin each other and ignore those who battle against the real threat (the kitin invasion) makes "the lore" a farce.

Of course ari is so populated that the final exodus of the remaining neutral player base is sure not to bother GF any.

[danolt]

Yes, obviously if the war escalates and the sides have to sacrifice more in order to serve their factions the neutrals should get rewards for standing on the side lines, that just makes sense.

This is a thread on the war, not the overall game. While I do agree there MUST be a way for people to aid the exodus without harming other players, the faction war storyline is a separate plot from the Kitin storyline. The rewards should be different and they should not be equal. A player makes the choice on their characters level of involvement in every plot on Atys, fairness is irrelevant.

[jared96]

But, the way I'm seeing the neutrals stand point is they want to take part in faction content,please correct me if I'm wrong, with out being apart of a recognized faction! Which can't happen with the current game mechanics at least IMO!

Yes, you're wrong, but only in your assumptions. I for one have no interets in factioned (homin versus homin) content. First a little history. For almost a year before release (various open and closed betas) and for well into the 2.5 year history of "retail" Ryzom, there were no factions "game mechanics wise". It existed in the lore but was not implemented in game. So a large portion of the player base fell in love what the game that they tried and formed their opinion not from what a marketing person wrote on a half buried web page but from their own experience in the trial period.

There was factioned content at that time but it did not give players an advantage. When peeps were forced to make a decision between going PvP or staying neutral as "second class citizens", there was a mass exodus from game, something Nexus frankly could ill afford. Server population has yet to recover as is easily shown in the Dig thread where old timers joke about a thing from long past called kami tolerance.

I have never seen a post where a neutral player was asking for "more" of anything than a factioned player. Yet why is it so essential to a factioned player's mindset that they get "more" than a non factioned player ? What is the origin of a mindset that a person who attacks homins from a foreign land is braver or worthy of more honor / reward than one who fights monsters.

There is simply no justifiable reason why neutrals can't "earn" whatever rewards are in game. For example, look at OP battles....would not the stench of rotting warriors in the field attract the hungry kitin. Would not both kami and kara benefit from bands of neutrals keeping the kitin off their backs. Would not the kami and kara benefit from keeping the kitin from swarming thier homes while they were off seeking glory in factioned contests ? While hordes of kara are attacking an OP in Fyros, can neutrals not play a role protecting Fairhaven or a Matisian OP from a kitin invasion ? Is such an act non worthy or praise, honor, reward ?




Quote if the day

"Never be surprised about a person's inability to understand something if their livelihood depends on their not understanding"

[tigrus]

Yes, you're wrong, but only in your assumptions. I for one have no interets in factioned (homin versus homin) content. First a little history. For almost a year before release (various open and closed betas) and for well into the 2.5 year history of "retail" Ryzom, there were no factions "game mechanics wise". It existed in the lore but was not implemented in game. So a large portion of the player base fell in love what the game that they tried and formed their opinion not from what a marketing person wrote on a half buried web page but from their own experience in the trial period.

There was factioned content at that time but it did not give players an advantage. When peeps were forced to make a decision between going PvP or staying neutral as "second class citizens", there was a mass exodus from game, something Nexus frankly could ill afford. Server population has yet to recover as is easily shown in the Dig thread where old timers joke about a thing from long past called kami tolerance.

I have never seen a post where a neutral player was asking for "more" of anything than a factioned player. Yet why is it so essential to a factioned player's mindset that they get "more" than a non factioned player ? What is the origin of a mindset that a person who attacks homins from a foreign land is braver or worthy of more honor / reward than one who fights monsters.

There is simply no justifiable reason why neutrals can't "earn" whatever rewards are in game. For example, look at OP battles....would not the stench of rotting warriors in the field attract the hungry kitin. Would not both kami and kara benefit from bands of neutrals keeping the kitin off their backs. Would not the kami and kara benefit from keeping the kitin from swarming thier homes while they were off seeking glory in factioned contests ? While hordes of kara are attacking an OP in Fyros, can neutrals not play a role protecting Fairhaven or a Matisian OP from a kitin invasion ? Is such an act non worthy or praise, honor, reward ?




Quote if the day

"Never be surprised about a person's inability to understand something if their livelihood depends on their not understanding"

All well and good but what did it have to do with the original post?
Make a new thread for discussion about neutral/factioned.
Or even better, il do it for you.