You deserve better than this, Jared, you really do.
But, I have work to do; and the fun factor of this thread is simply drying up.
Still, I will take a swing and see what happens.
jared96 wrote:The majority of the nation's highways have a 55 mph speed limit. So, by your argument, us engineers shouldn't bother designing crash barriers, guide rails, highway curves, bumper systems, etc for anything greater than a 55 mph impact (or 65 mph where so designated) . I tend to lean towards the "real world approach" knowing that peeps routinely drive 75 in a 55 and deal with "what is" rather that than what someone thought it would be.
Yeah...I am not going to swap RL analogies with you, as someone always needs to take it to a stupid extent.
jared96 wrote:
And you can't argue the fact that more access to better materials and twice the advancement rate results in an extreme advantage.
Sure I can!
jared96 wrote:
If ya gonna argue that point.... "show me the math"
No!
But I will say. The OP equipment is fun, but not overwhelming. And...for what seems to be the hundredth time, cats do not double advancement rate. An OP makes about 14 stacks a day. If you hold an OP you probalby have about that many active players (or more). You can burn though a stack of mats in about 30 minutes or less, depending on what you are doing. So, if the server were locked so that a player can only get XP for 30 minutes per day...then maybe the whole "double advancement rate" would hold water. Until then, let's just leave it at "cats are bad", shall we?
jared96 wrote:
As a neutral character in a neutral guild, I get a lot of PM's from new players asking about both sides. About 85% of them have already decided their faction when I talk to them and most of these start the conversation with "I am going kara...." . The ones that haven't are asking which group is larger ? which group controls more territory ? which group is in power ? which group will have the most "stuff" to offer me and help me level.
So...you have done scientific survey gleaning data from new character that have sent you tells? Yeah...I gotta say, that is pretty strong evidence. I don't suppose there is any room at all for any type of bias in your iron-clad and proven methods? nah...of course not.
But, I'll tell ya what...I will go off the amount of new players I see at OP battles (you know, the only metric that has any bearing on the topic), and you can go off "new dudes that send you tells". Have fun with that.
jared96 wrote:
IIRC, there were 28 OP"s .... let's set aside 4 for the neutrals for the moment as 24 is an easy number to work. At 12-12 things are gonna be most interesting. The greater the imbalance, the more it favors the winning side. At 16-8 there's a 2:1 advantage. Guilds with the alliance with the advantage can recruit twice as many people who will level twice as fast. Win just 2 more OP's and it goes to 3:1 Win 2 more and it's 5:1
Math is hard.
But your logic is bad. Twice the OPs does not translate into twice the recruitment rate (resiting urge for RL analogy here). And please, for the love of Jena, give up the "level twice as fast" thing. It just ain't true.
jared96 wrote:
1 person x 8 hours / day x 3 shifts x 30.4 days per month = 729.6 hours
So to employ 1 person at a mid clerical / low technical professional rate of $20/hr...
729.6 x 20 = $14,592
$14,952 x 2.5 = $36,480
$36,480 / $15 per month = 2,432 subscribers to support 1 staff person
You think aris has 2,500 paying subscribers ? You think it can be kept up with one staff person ? If you don't then I would hope you take player's stated reasons for leaving the game seriously.
Again with the math...ouch...it burn us!!! it BURNS us!!!
So, you are making the point that the poorly implemented PvP/OP system has cost the game players, and perhaps contributed to Nevrax going out of buisness. What a startling and insightful thought...where have I read that before...hrrrmmm....I wonder...OH YES!
I have been saying it for months! I don't know who you are trying to convince here, but I am already converted.
But, there is much more to it that just the decision to focus on PvP, isn't there? Since OPs, nothing else important has happened. The Ring kinda sucks, the Halloween event was cheesy and meaningless. If the Saga were to actually progress, more people would stick around, I think.
jared96 wrote:
The lore supports this in the sense that neither "god" has overcome the other meaning they have a balance of a power. That power is also limited. It stands to reason therefore that the god "boosting" 20 people can't do as much individually for each of the 20 as the other god "boosting" 10 people as ecah has only so much of their own pwer to darw on.
Three problems with this...the first being obvious and oft repeated:
The OPs are not FvF!!!
The dieties don't get involved because it is not thier fight. So a lore based handicap system involving godly stat boosts simply wouldn't make any sense.
The second...are you really suggesting limiting the impact of individual contribution by implementing a system control? If one side goes to the effort of reqruiting, training and turning out more players than the other side, then the side that has gone to the effort deserves to the punished?
(and your handicap analogies really only apply to friendly games. profesional competitions don't use them. The league winner from last year doesn't start off with a 10 point penalty against the league looser. sorry...couldn't help myself.)
Third: Let's say it really was an FvF sort of thing. If niether side can win, why fight? Yeah, some players think the struggle itself is fun and all, but personally, I would like it all to go somewhere, you know? I could play either side (soldier mainting hard won order/ idealistic revolutionary trying to bring down teh establishment) and have a lot of fun with it. But a constant pointless struggle that goes no where? Why bother?
jared96 wrote:
Doesn't matter to me "gamewise" either way as I don't partake. But those that do will have to weigh their opposition to "balance" against the long term survival of the game because many people are unhappy to the point of not playing anymore.
I think most of the damage has been done. Those that were upset enough about it have already left, and it is pretty unlikly they will come back.
There might be those that say "My team can't win, so I am quitting." That is thier call. I am pretty sure pandering to a player like that is pointless, since they would just find something else that is "too hard" and quit over that.
Again, I don't really dig OPs. And I certainly don't like PvP...I steer clear of it unless I am at a battle. I can certainly live without the OP mats and crystals, I really don't care if I have them or not. But, my guild wants to play in this game, and my alliance is really cool, so I support them.
I wish "something else" had been pursued instead of PvP...but we have what we have. Turning it off would just make more people upset. Some sort of "balancing mechanism" would punish those that worked to get where they are, and I am completly against that sort of nonsence.
Anyway, I have had fun with this. I hope you have too. If you wanna keep it up, I will probably oblige; that is the sort of narcisist I am. But. honestly, I am out of things to say on the topic.
"And you believe, despite knowing that the rest of the entire physical universe is nothing but a series of physical reactions, just pebbles bouncing down a board. The only object in fifteen billion light years in every direction that can choose rests inside the boney bowl atop your shoulders. Right?"
--David Wong
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