Can someone provide a NWN comparison to the RR Toolset?

[archaege]

I had a blast with NWN's toolset, so much so that I made the HCR mod for it (for anyone that remembers)

My question is can someone give me a comparison with it? Is there a scripting language of any sort?

The one thing always missing from NWN was the MMO aspect, so this is really appealing to me, and Im redownloading the SoR client to try it out again (havent played since launch) but am curious about the strength of the toolset?

(If this is the wrong forum for this, or you can point me to a link that answers this, please let me know)

Archaegeo

[rothimar]

I never dabbled with NWN, so I can't give you a comparison... but perhaps the R2 manual would be of help? I am reading it now (while at work...shhhhh)

http://www.ryzom.com/documentation/Manuals/ring/ryzom_ring_manual.pdf/download

[marct]

If you are familiar with computer programming the best likeness is to say that it is event driven. Events happen and you can trigger any number of other things in your scenario off of them.

It is not raw text scripting today although there has been some hinting that some really advanced things may be possible like that in the future.

The things you can accomplish in the event model they have built are really powerful.

The big items are:

Entities (NPC's and mobs)
Triggers (a zone trigger, and some others I can't remember)
Dialogs (text, although not quite a conversation system)
Sequences (The travel and roaming system or paths and areas)
Tasks (Request item, give item, and talk to entity tasks)


And the Big One that really puts it over the top is the Adventure Mastering(AMing) abilities. As the Adventure Master(AM), in Real time while people are playing your scenario you may talk as any one of the NPC's that are in your scenario, and you may take control of any entitiy that exist as well moving around the scenario. Although I have not seen a way to change an enties it's target or force it to attack someone in particular. The last big thing as an AM is the ability to flip triggers in the scenario manually.


You can't get in today to script behavior like changing the way a mob acts. Of course wouldn't that just break the likeness and believability that it is still Ryzom. Although you can turn the Aggro off and on for predators via a check box or triggering via Event.

Hope that helps. It really is next Generation in my mind. I am acutally glad you can't change terrain, it already takes me way to long to finish a scenario. (I'm a bit OCD)

[grimjim]

It's much more intuitive but broader and shallower than the NWN customisation tools.

You can't go into as much detail but it is farrrrrrrrrrr easier to use.

[tinil]

Compared to NWN Toolest, this is no way near as good. It is simpler to use R2 toolset, took me less than 30 mins to create a reasonable scenario with several functional quests.

But it is no way as deep as the NWN toolset, no ability to alter terrain (not sure if they are going to add this or not). If you only have the option of the premade maps and no ability to raise lower hills, add water where you like, generally all round terrain formation there is going to be alot of repetitveness in landscapes. Also you cannot alter creature scripts like you can in NWN or the AI amongst many things you cannot do with the Ring toolset.

I understand this is only beta, but creating my own land mass etc, was what I had been hoping for, if the ability is not going to be there I can personally see no point in me making any Ring scenarios (which I was hoping to do).

After spending a good few years fiddling with the NWN Toolset and making several Persistent Worlds for the game, the largest having just over 400 areas. I will just pick up a copy of NWN2 and make more worlds until my heart is content and for free.

If there is going to be the ability to alter terrain, landscaping and ability to make an area from a "blank canvas" so to speak, please correct me.. if not, I can see myself moving on to something else for a few months or longer.

And Archaegeo, your HCR scripts were really impressive, even though pretty old now.. I had previously used parts of them in some of the modules I had made, well I know a lot of people who have based a lot of work off your scripts also


Tinil

[rothimar]

It has been stated in numerous threads and announcements that the R2 toolset would not have all of its features live upon initial release, and this is only beta.

The toolset needs to be easy to use, dynamic, and provide the ability for the content created to fit with the lore and mechanics of the existing game.

R2 is not a GDK, it is a scenario creation tool.

[marct]

*Wishes he could create a scenario in 30 minutes*

I must say I am quite fine at the moment with not creating/ manipulating terrain. As it is It already takes me in excess of 10 hours or more to create a scenario.

Maybe I am doing something wrong, but I think adding that ability would just slow 98% of the users down to the point they get frustrated and give the 2% that would really have a use for it a cool tool.

Maybe in the future, but I don't think it is necessary at the moment. I would like to see the conversation system, and a few other thigns first.

I would more like to see the ability for folks to create and skin 3d models and submit them to Nevrax for inclusion into the Ring library. In addition, the little icons for plot items would seem easy enough for users to make also.

[rothimar]

Agreed, the simplicity of the current toolset is one of its appeals. I would rather not spend 95% of my gaming time learning a whole scripting system. And personally, I would rather not play scenarios that are not consistant with the rest of Ryzom. I would like to make scenarios as something fun to do, or for Guild training/events. And I would prefer to play scenarios that are created by people who play the game, rather than simply sign up to make scenarios. People who play Ryzom will be more inclinded to keep their scenarios true to the feel of Atys. Whike it would be nice to edit terrain, it's not essential in making a good scenario.

That means, keep the AI consistant with the current mechanics of Ryzom.

But... that's just my opinion.

*edit* - I don't look at R2 as competition for NWN. I look at it for what it is. A toolset for Ryzom to give players the ability to create their own scenarios. I don't see it as an all powerful game development kit, nor do I believe it was intended to be complex in it's interface.

[truce1]

One is for an MMO, the other isn't.

[sutra]

Hi Archaege, all,

I think the notion of The Ring is not to do too much too soon; they appear to be focusing on getting out the 'raw basics' and then, depending of course on success 'measurements', add more.

So: as far as I know, no scripting language. But if it is successful, they will surely realize (as you and I do; yes I recall HCR ) that the *best* things of all NWN modules are the scripted events. From chicken coops to...oh well most eveything.

Now there are of course many ways to implement: for instance, what is the Bandit Camp or Fauna Ecosystem, if not a pre-scripted 'event organizer'?

My personal impression is that it is smart to get it working so all paying subscribers to Ryzom can give it a go and be successful in making a basic but fun scenario; let's face it the one thing Ryzom misses is mission-oriented (not holding-by-your-hand!) gameplay. The Ring will offer just that.

I have been wrong in assuming the Bioware Austin (newly opened) game studio would be making the first MMORPG with Player Made Content. It is the way of the future I think and Nevrax has the premiere.

I applaud them for their guts and efforts and I hope they will be sufficiently successful to keep adding more options. Most notably, for now:
1) Area editing including dungeon/interior area design.
2) *Much* higher Object allowance.
3) Scripting language and/or more pre-scripted items.

After that: choice of music, lighting, and well, there is nothing new to my wish I think: more of everything .

Sincerely,
Lucas (back to making a noob adventure).


* I say, there is no
* darkness but ignorance.
-
* Twelfth-night; or, What You Will