Neutral TP's just got Fixed ?

[phradok]

*takes bitter pill of Episode 2 marginalizing neutral players - swallows it*

*takes bitter pill of no Prime Roots pacts for neutral players - chokes it down*

Number of pacts cut suddenly in half for neutral players
*takes cyanide pill*

[kostika]

Why is it unacceptable for neutral to no longer be able to purchase TP pacts from faction altars? From a story POV, it is easily argued that the Kami and/or Karavan would only sell to those with whom they enjoy a +0 or better relationship.

From an IC point of view I'm with you. But that isn't how Nevrax told us it would work. Also that's not how they were working up until now. Changing how things work without telling the players you're changing it isn't acceptable. As someone else said, stealth changes jsut don't fly. Especially big changes like this.

[dhuberma]

From an IC point of view I'm with you. But that isn't how Nevrax told us it would work. Also that's not how they were working up until now. Changing how tings work without telling the players you're changing it isn't acceptable. As someone else said, stealth changes jsut don't fly. Especially big changes like this.

Ok, I can accept that. I'm new here, and do not have a similar perspective (obviously).

[oldmess]

How does it take time to become kara? If you're matis or tryker, you're automatically kara by default. If you're Fyros or Zorai and attempting to go Kara, then you're going against the ways of your people and it should be a challenge. You turn your back on your people and their religion, they return the favor.

I guess I haven't created an alt in a while, but I thought they had to get to 30 fame before doing the rite. Are you saying new toons start at 30 fame for their default faction?

Also, most of my "newer" members are not quite that new. So they don't have whatever default a new toon gets are still working on it. Sorry, but not everyone plays are frequently as you or I and they haven't gotten their fame up.

[dhuberma]

Default is 20/-20

[oldmess]

yeps agree with that 100%. when i started it was at least two months before i purchased a tp ticket. Older players think that its bad for new players only because they are looking at things from the wrong perspective.

I don't believe my perspective is "wrong". I've got a new player and I want to invite him to join in a hunt. Sure, he should be stuck soloing in Majestic Garden cause that's clearly more fun than joining his guildmates and working his heal skill.

Also, I want to help a player that's nearing 50 in harvest and in the forest, the best place to show him is Kami Circle. Now, it's an easy enough run from the Kara TP, but that one doesn't sell to neutrals. Only the Kami one does.

All in all, this whole mixed bag of who can access what tp's has been frustrating for me helping my newer players. That's not theory or wrong perspective; that's my actual experience. At first, it was sold to us as balanced because neutrals have almost as many tp's as factioned players. (not including the roots). If this is intentional, it's cutting the neutrals out even further with no tradeoff to balance *and* it's a stealth patch.

NEVRAX - Please someone respond to this thread. If it's just a bug, we're getting worked up for nothing.

[oldmess]

Default is 20/-20

Thanks. So it's less an issue for the newest players. They can do 10 fame points before they must have some of these TP's.

But, the newer players that started just before the patch (and yes, I'm talking about real players that have expressed real frustation to me, not just hypotheticals), they started at 0/0 because the racial modifiers weren't applied during the upgrade.

[phradok]

I don't believe my perspective is "wrong". I've got a new player and I want to invite him to join in a hunt. Sure, he should be stuck soloing in Majestic Garden cause that's clearly more fun than joining his guildmates and working his heal skill.

Also, I want to help a player that's nearing 50 in harvest and in the forest, the best place to show him is Kami Circle. Now, it's an easy enough run from the Kara TP, but that one doesn't sell to neutrals. Only the Kami one does.

All in all, this whole mixed bag of who can access what tp's has been frustrating for me helping my newer players. That's not theory or wrong perspective; that's my actual experience.

Some good points here. This is not as bad from an individual character perspective, as it is from a guild leadership perspective (Neutral or otherwise). Want to take a trek with us to see a new land and visit favorite training areas? Whoops, you can't make most of the pacts you need along the way. Go ahead, sit in your low level region while the rest of the guild is off training. That's the quickest way to get new player to quit the game.

And if there is a +Karavan/+Kami workaround for neutral characters, what's the point of the patch except to create a general increase in the annoyance factor for neutrals. My principles prevent my character from doing missions for the Karavan or Kami in any event.

To me this is Nevrax's not-so-subtle way of saying "Neutrals, you aren't welcome in the game anymore, either join a faction or get out. Because once spires go live, you are going to work for whatever faction you have the highest rating with anyways, or see further reductions in your ability to travel."

I hope this is just a bug and that people are getting worked up about nothing.

[rushin]

I don't believe my perspective is "wrong". I've got a new player and I want to invite him to join in a hunt. Sure, he should be stuck soloing in Majestic Garden cause that's clearly more fun than joining his guildmates and working his heal skill.

Also, I want to help a player that's nearing 50 in harvest and in the forest, the best place to show him is Kami Circle. Now, it's an easy enough run from the Kara TP, but that one doesn't sell to neutrals. Only the Kami one does.

All in all, this whole mixed bag of who can access what tp's has been frustrating for me helping my newer players. That's not theory or wrong perspective; that's my actual experience. At first, it was sold to us as balanced because neutrals have almost as many tp's as factioned players. (not including the roots). If this is intentional, it's cutting the neutrals out even further with no tradeoff to balance *and* it's a stealth patch.

NEVRAX - Please someone respond to this thread. If it's just a bug, we're getting worked up for nothing.

I think my point stands, in your response you wrote i, i, i.. not the new player is bored of a lv50 region even though he cant kill most of the things there, but you think they will have more fun off hunting in a zone they can only heal in. surely they would have fun teaming with ppl of their own level in a zone that suits their abilities? if not buy them a mount, or spend 15mins getting them a fame point so they can buy some tps (or an hour for a really new player to get from 20 to 30 with the help of guild). i wasnt making a personal attack on you but merely an observation that older players often rush newer ones into high level content when there is no need, and its infact detrimental to the longevity they will find and enjoyment they experience.

[katriell]

My principles prevent my character from doing missions for the Karavan or Kami in any event.

Doesn't prevent Jelly...in her opinion, there's nothing wrong with doing bandit population control for both sides. Bandits hate everyone equally, including neutrals. Plus, doing missions for both has a feel of sweet defiance and disregard.