Ryzom

After reading through the marketing forum 'Read ME First' post, I saw them mention the Firefox campaigns that were started to help Firefox get noticed.

Part of the reason people were so motivated to spread Firefox was due to it being open source software. People who had worked on the browser felt motivated to spread the word since they had personally helped in the creation of the product. Essentially, they didn't want to see something they had invested time and effort in vanish. Also at the time, open source was a buzz word and helped feature the browser in many different types of media, from TV to magazines to online blogs.

At the time of Nevrax's bankruptcy there was talk of a group of individuals purchasing the game and making it open source and the forums that were set up by the group had a large number of individuals that were interested in seeing an open source MMO (Its going to happen sooner or later, if it hasn't already...). The manner in which the game was going to be run tended to be an issue of concern for many players as players would still be required to pay a subscription to the game. As a result, some felt that the company was taking advantage of the open source element, essentially taking game development for free while pocketing game sub money. While the community discussed what it hoped to do with the game, GameForge placed a higher bid and was able to obtain the game code. Well, we all know what a great job they did...

So, the benefits of making Ryzom open source:

-Development speed has always been a complaint of players of this game. In the numerous years since its release it has seen very few patches in which major content was added and I believe it is one of the main reasons for player turnover. By releasing the game as an open source game, the game would see a drastic improvement in game development time. There will be some initial hurdles to overcome, but once the core team of contributors is established, the game will see a decent level of development.

-Discussion regarding the games roadmap will be clearer. Currently we have no idea what the plan is. We have some vague and oddly worded posts about 'Animation' but that's about it. By having a community that is working on the game, the roadmap will be a bit clearer and discussion regarding where the game should be heading/what needs working on would actually be a two way conversation.

-Marketing. Media loves open source, especially when its taking on established businesses. Everyone has an opinion on it all and quite often can't wait to get it out. Imagine being on the front page of Yahoo or featured in PC Gamer as the MMO of the future with hundreds of developers all contributing to make a perfected game. I have the feeling that it would draw a large crowd to the site.

Now to make the whole issue of who gets the money go away, make Ryzom free to play (F2P). Currently the game is seeing people leave and it is already free to play. The CFO would be a fool to think that people would be willing to pay for a game that they aren't willing to play for free. On top of that there is the issue of money and contributed work. So make the client free with no subscription and instead open an item mall like those found in most F2P games. The ability to buy cats, OP mats, titles, familiars, special mounts, DP removers, etc would allow for the servers to be covered cost-wise while retaining the option for players uneasy with paying for open source code to play without fees.
Speaking from personal experience, I have played several F2P games and I usually ended up paying for several items each month. For example, in Silkroad I would hire a Looter Squirrel. It was a small squirrel that looted mobs for me. It wasn't game breaking and essentially just allowed me to be lazy, but it was convenient enough that I paid each month to retain my furry friend.

The current trend with the new owners of Ryzom has been to reach out to the player base. Correcting in-game texts, CSRs, Marketing, etc. So why not finish the trend. Make the game open source and maybe we'll finally see Ryzom receive the attention it deserves.

Ehm, you did notice this: http://dev.ryzom.com/ ?

The Engine behind Ryzom already is open source, so join
I can´t program for the life of me.

CU
Acridiel

acridiel wrote:Ehm, you did notice this: http://dev.ryzom.com/ ?

The Engine behind Ryzom already is open source, so join
I can´t program for the life of me.

CU
Acridiel

Not talking about the engine. I mean the game in its entirety.

Alot on Atys is based on the players personal knowledge of the world, its mechanics and not the players levels. If the game mechanics were completely open source I believe people would just go and read up on them to push everything to the technical limit and gain an advantage. A good example would be crafting or the weather system.

They lose alot of attraction if people get access to all those mechanics, of course you don't have to look, but how would you feel if the homin next to you is exactly at the right time at the rigth spot in PR to empty it - just because he/she *did* take a look at the sources and you didn't.

cielchan wrote:Alot on Atys is based on the players personal knowledge of the world, its mechanics and not the players levels. If the game mechanics were completely open source I believe people would just go and read up on them to push everything to the technical limit and gain an advantage. A good example would be crafting or the weather system.

They lose alot of attraction if people get access to all those mechanics, of course you don't have to look, but how would you feel if the homin next to you is exactly at the right time at the rigth spot in PR to empty it - just because he/she *did* take a look at the sources and you didn't.

True, but its already been that way for a very long time. There are java programs that tell Atysian time and predict season change for example. There was also an ability to bring up a debug screen that showed a whole slew of information that included the exact weather number which was associated with what mats were up (they fixed it so that this was no longer available to clients). All of this was being used by some of the best diggers on Atys to get the best mats in game and in an efficient manner since they knew what mats would be popping when using numbers that weren't available to the uninformed digger.

That system went on for years without anyone doing anything to prevent it.

Also, as with all MMOs, there will be a fan site that will list all of the souces/times/weather/etc and the information would be readily available to those who wished to find it (much as it is already with various sites).

There is also the fact that with open development a better system of resource spawning could be derived.

Great, so what you´re saying is:

"Some are playing unfair already, so let´s even out the field by making the unfair advantages available to all. And screw the consequences."

*clap, clap,clap*

What a great step into the "right direction".

This entire discussion was held many times before and while Open Source may have it´s advantages, these will never outweigh the disadvantages to me.
I´ve said it before and will do so again: I despise the use of these sites, I despise the use of any 3d party programs to gain advantage over others and I would not stay in an open sourced Ryzom,
that just gave itself and its identity away for the sake of "easier" play.

And a "better System for resource spawning" could just as well be developed by regular devs.
And even if it was developed by part of an OS Community, another part of the same Community would then find ways to exploit it again.
So it´ll just turn into a vicious circle.

That´s it from me in this thread.

CU
Acridiel

acridiel wrote:Great, so what you´re saying is:

"Some are playing unfair already, so let´s even out the field by making the unfair advantages available to all. And screw the consequences."

*clap, clap,clap*

What a great step into the "right direction".

no my point was that it is already happening and isn't something would be created by making the game open source.

As with all games, there are fan sites that will help the player who is looking for information. This information isn't forced on to any one player and only those who go looking for it will find it. This makes it so that players can choose how much outside help they receive. The same applies to Ryzom and resource spawns and there are a number of sites up that point out spawns and potential weather that they will spawn in. Has this ruined the game? No. Has it given a player an unfair advantage? not really since there is resource tracking in-game.
The idea that someone will have all the games secrets is a bit of stretch.

acridiel wrote:This entire discussion was held many times before and while Open Source may have it´s advantages, these will never outweigh the disadvantages to me.
I´ve said it before and will do so again: I despise the use of these sites, I despise the use of any 3d party programs to gain advantage over others and I would not stay in an open sourced Ryzom,
that just gave itself and its identity away for the sake of "easier" play.

The only advantage I see with the current owners is that they have kept the game servers up. They did a few minor tweaks to bugs and in-game corrections, but an OS could do that easily and probably in less time. They have no detailed anything they plan to do with the game and seem to be only interested in how much we'll pay for a sub.
As for 3rd party programs, I agree that botting and the like is unacceptable. However, I think a page can be taken from the WOW book when it comes to mods. The ability to customize my UI, mob HP/abilities, crafting screen, or the ability to add small extras (such as an in-game notepad) made playing WoW much more enjoyable. There were rules that applied to the mods (they couldn't do anything for you, just assist you in a task) and they certainly didn't make or break the game, but they were a very nice addition.

acridiel wrote:]And a "better System for resource spawning" could just as well be developed by regular devs.

we've seen a pittance of dev work on Ryzom. Yes, it would be wonderful to have them develop it, but we've not seen anything close to the amount of dev work that other MMOs have received in the same amount of time. Currently we don't even know if there IS a dev team.
"If we had some ham we could have some ham sandwiches if we had some bread"

acridiel wrote:And even if it was developed by part of an OS Community, another part of the same Community would then find ways to exploit it again.
So it´ll just turn into a vicious circle.

Thats an inherent aspect of ANY game. There will always be people who will find a weakness in the current code to exploit it. The benefit of a OS community is that the reaction time of discovering and fixing it is smaller due to the larger number of eyes on the code and in the game. Over the years we've seen invulnerability glitches, easter egg stacking, OP flower stacking, XP cats moved out of bag when crafting causing a server crash, glitching through walls, etc. Most of those glitches stayed around for years without anyone even recognizing they were an issue. Would the same happen in a community that was 1) more vocal than any Ryzom has seen yet and 2) had a slew of people pouring over the code?