Ryzom

Creative Director David Cohen Corval has just published a new letter to the community. In today's issue, he talks about planned PvP, PvE and roleplaying aspects.

Link: http://www.ryzom.com/?page=news&id=934

Feel free to discuss!

There is a lie that is being spread around Atys.

It gets repeated quite a bit by those that promote the game, but don't actually play it.

It is the lie of "consensual" PvP.

Oh, sure..PvP in SoR is "consensual," if:

you never go into the roots.

you never try to get supreme mats.

you don't mind missing out on half of the events.

your guild will never want to have an outpost.

So, yes, I suppose that, in the same way playing SoR at all is voluntary, PvP in SoR is also voluntary. You could choose to stay out of the PvP areas and events, but you would miss out on much of the already scarce content.

In every iteration, PvP attracts the very worst of MMO players. Children, really, that can't manage a complete sentence that doesn't include Internet shorthand. PvP situations not only attract these players, but it gives them a place where they can not be ignored...thus giving them what they so desperately crave; more attention.

I do not understand why so much effort is being put in to enhancing an aspect of the game that most of us do not want, while features that we need in order to keep our interest in playing are being ignored. Why is PvP a higher priority than fixing the RAID engine to handle dynamic invasions? Why is it that gankfests are being elevated above plot lines? Why are the encyclopedia and team-based missions being put on the back burner in order to provide the worst elements of our community more opportunities to act out?

I keep harboring this idea that PvP could work, if it were done correctly. I have heard the same thought from many other players. Competition between guilds can be enjoyable and exciting. However, that line of reasoning is quite a bit like saying Communism could work, if the right people were involved. History shows that time and time again it all ends in incalculable disaster, yet we never seem to learn. Every MMO that has implemented PvP has devolved into belligerent problem children getting attention by interrupting the fun of everyone else. Yet, we never seem to learn. Game developers always say "this time, we will do it right" and players always believe them. Yet, every time, we abandon the integrity of the story in order to fend off attacks, or we make alts to join in the gankfest, or we just give up on the game completely; realizing that trying to deal with these cretins is simply not worth the energy.

It really isn’t too late for SoR. The PvP zones can be turned off quickly. The PvP strike teams can be assigned to fix the RAID engine, or finish off the rites, or progress the storyline. Developers can actually listen to what we are telling them, and provide content, not PvP. PvP would then actually be consensual; players might start coming back to the game if there were more to do.

But we have been saying this for a long time, and the updates we receive from Mr. Corval and Ms. Mulligan continue to show us that our concerns are not important, because, this time, they will do it right.

<applause right up until you use Communism as a bad example, since outside of very small communes Communism has never been practiced and so there's no way to tell>

I agree, I'd love a decent answer as to why so much effort is being 'wasted' on these PvP aspects

Ency missions might be there and then done, older players will pick them off as they pop up pretty quickly but for newer players they present quite a lot to do as well as adding a massive amount to the story and race/civ diversification.

I think PvP is being used (or they're *trying* to use it) as a diversion tool. PvP, even with Ryzom's Fame and Faction mechanisms, is far easier to implement than new content. Mainly, I guess, because a lot of PvP would not require any new assets i.e. art and design work. Most of the mechanisms are already in place for PvE tasks, and need to be adjusted and tweaked to work between players - no new models, maps or endless paragraphs of text that have to mean something.

I feel this PvP is intended as a time sink, and that is not what this game needs.

PVP is probably being implemented to get this damn racial war off the ground. Damn it PVE isnt fun, I can only kill the same Bodoc so many times before I get bored (and I'm low/mid level so heaven help the poor sods who ground all the way to lvl250). Right now I'd rather have a means and motivation to join the Matis army in their glorious fight against the Fyros insurgence than kill another Bodoc (or even a Kitin before you bring up the Kitin raids, its just more PvE only a touch more random).
A well guided faction war with well implemented PvP would not be a poor time sink it would be a god send - it just so happens wars take a while to fight and during this time more amber cubes may be discovered on the well worn field of battle.

PvP can be done well, it doesnt have to detrimental to those who chose not to PvP (I'm not high enough level yet to get down to the roots safely but down even there you come across PvE situations which are dangerous no? In what way is this really different to a PvP scenario?). Hell if this is really an issue then hire body guards, the Samsara fight for money right? Well hire them as mercenary bodyguards then for a nominal fee/goods.
These things do not have to be the end of the world as some on this forum are attempting to position them. They are different aspects to the world and should be embraced.

This is the part I am most concerned about:

"In this model, the PvP players provide the PvE players with additional contents to have fun with (once they’ve won the Outpost). The Role Players will in turn feed the PvP players with new reasons to act, objectives to achieve, purposes to defend, et al."

I somehow doubt that PvP players are going to provide anything to anyone not in their own small, tightly bonded group of friends, who will for the most part be... other PvP players.

I'm also skeptical about his assumption that the PvP players will follow leads from roleplayers, taking their initiatives for action based on roleplay reasons. I don't see a lot of interest in traditional roleplaying on the part of the most powerful PvP MMORPG players even in Ryzom, with it's much touted "mature" community. Certainly it wasn't a driving motivation in my last game (UO). From what I've seen so for from most of the strong PvP guilds and players, it's all about pushing other people around and getting even more power.

To sum it up: The RAID engine is not working so we are going to have you fight each other but we will not force you to participate in PvP but you get no content if you choose not to.
I will hope for the best but don't like what I see so far.

I prefer RAIDs than pvp, but like Neva said I don't see the RAID working as it should, plus I see when ever they are "releasing" the Outpost is going to be pure pvp...

all sounds like alot of fun i cant wait

basicart wrote:all sounds like alot of fun i cant wait

lol but you have to and a looooong time to