Why do the Zorai have a neg faction with the Trykers?

[raynes]

As our actions will play a very important part in how the game goes I am trying to learn about the Zorai. I noticed that the Zorai have a -8 faction with the Trykers. Anyone know the reasoning behing this?

[shrike]

As our actions will play a very important part in how the game goes I am trying to learn about the Zorai. I noticed that the Zorai have a -8 faction with the Trykers. Anyone know the reasoning behing this?

It seems to me thati t's a simple balance thingy. Fyros and Tryker have already good relations, so Zorai couldn't have them, too.

Zorai have also a +8 standing with Mantis, which now REALLY doesn't fits with the background story.

[ayne31]

I agree that simple math is the reason and while were at it: does -8 mean one is KOS in the settlements or just to be ignored?

[raynes]

It seems to me thati t's a simple balance thingy. Fyros and Tryker have already good relations, so Zorai couldn't have them, too.

Zorai have also a +8 standing with Mantis, which now REALLY doesn't fits with the background story.

I don't get it. Why couldn't the Zorai have good relations with the Trykers? Your saying it's a balance thing, but where is it written or even implied that for every good race relation there has to be a bad?

As important as the story is to this game I can't beleive that one race has a negative faction with another just for balance issues. There has to be a story related reason. If you are right and it is simply for balance, then either the story isn't as important to the game as I thought, or it's just sloppy background work. Can someone official help us out with this?

[ayne31]

I don't get it. Why couldn't the Zorai have good relations with the Trykers? Your saying it's a balance thing, but where is it written or even implied that for every good race relation there has to be a bad?

As important as the story is to this game I can't beleive that one race has a negative faction with another just for balance issues. There has to be a story related reason. If you are right and it is simply for balance, then either the story isn't as important to the game as I thought, or it's just sloppy background work. Can someone official help us out with this?

I agree somehow using only 8s and 16s for faction is not the only mathematical solution

[raynes]

I agree somehow using only 8s and 16s for faction is not the only mathematical solution

Is that what Shrike meant? That the faction system is based upon 8's so therefore it's a balance issue? That's just plain wrong. When I got the Icon Workshippers faction from doing a mission for them, the faction started out at +33. That isn't a multiple of 8. There is more to the reasoning behind the faction number than balance. If it were simply balance and not story related everything would start out at 0.

[shrike]

Is that what Shrike meant? That the faction system is based upon 8's so therefore it's a balance issue?...

No, it's not what I meant.

Fyros have +8 Tryker, -8 Mantis and -16 Zorai
Tryker have +8 Fyros, -8 Zorai and -16 Mantis
Mantis have +8 Zorai, -8 Fyros and -16 Tryker
Zorai have +8 Mantis, -8 Tryker and -16 Fyros

There is no race which is liked by 2 other races (THAT is the balance issue I spoke of). And since Fyros and Tryker are already obviously pretty good mates (being trade partners after all), the only option left for Zorai are Mantis.

Of cource, it does make zero sense with the background story, but if the background story would be followed to the latter mantis would have bad relations with ALL races and therefore being in a disadvantage. Again, balance....

-16 is not "kill on sight", btw. The -16 in Fyros are causing me somewhat higher buy and lower sell prices with the NPCs there, but thats all (haven't tried if the guards defend me, though).

[raynes]

No, it's not what I meant.

Fyros have +8 Tryker, -8 Mantis and -16 Zorai
Tryker have +8 Fyros, -8 Zorai and -16 Mantis
Mantis have +8 Zorai, -8 Fyros and -16 Tryker
Zorai have +8 Mantis, -8 Tryker and -16 Fyros

There is no race which is liked by 2 other races (THAT is the balance issue I spoke of). And since Fyros and Tryker are already obviously pretty good mates (being trade partners after all), the only option left for Zorai are Mantis.

Of cource, it does make zero sense with the background story, but if the background story would be followed to the latter mantis would have bad relations with ALL races and therefore being in a disadvantage. Again, balance....

-16 is not "kill on sight", btw. The -16 in Fyros are causing me somewhat higher buy and lower sell prices with the NPCs there, but thats all (haven't tried if the guards defend me, though).

So the makers of this game have a story. They push that as a major part of the game. But when it comes to making the game, they can't write the story to work the game mechanics due to balance issues? WTF is my responce to that. What's the point of the faction system and the story if they don't work together? Better yet if the faction system is at odds with the faction system why not just make everything start at 0?

[gralen]

Here is the rationale that makes sense to me as to the race relations (fame):

Fyros and Tryker are natural allies due to the water situation.

Matis are negative with Fyros and Tryker also because of the water situation, and the invasion of Fyros lands and the Tryker enslavement.

Zoraï don't really care about the other races as much as they care about Atys. Since the Matis are also very interested in nature (being genetic manipulators of plants) the Zoraï are naturally interested in Matis know-how to try to help cure the Goo. That interest earns the Zoraï animosity from the other two races because of the water/invasion/slavery issues.

[ayne31]

What I meant was that +8/-8/-16 makes a toal of -16. (and a straigth total of 0 ragrding Kami and Karavan) within this total EVERY combination would be balanced like
race 1: +8/-8/-16
race 2: 0/-6/-10
race 3: +2/0/-18
race 4: +6/-8/-14

in that way they faction could have been more consistent with the story while still being balanced as a whole.

That simple -8/+8/-16 was nothing less then dumb and lazy and doesnt fit at all into the efforts there had been put into design otherwise as it takes less than 1hour to come up with a solution thats better than the current one.