dakhound wrote:try killing jugukoo without a tank then tell me melee are useless, in fact screw jugukoo go try tanking tyrankoo in light armour, thats fun
it does not even need to be q270 supreme boss. any mob that hits hard and fast (especially fast), will make tanking mage only bunching bag and requires a few healers.
mage cant cast (not be able to dodge and interruptions), so you need second mage to do damage - it's better to have tank in full HA to make healer life _alot_ easyer.
only thing there is no need for tank is for small HP mobs where nuker can drop them in 2 or 3 hits (melee will significantly slow things down or slow hitting mobs (like "normal" plods where you are very close to each other (ele and healers), so healers can use bomb efficiently and few ele can take plod down a relatively fast
.. and then there is thing like fear. if you can make mob run 95% of the time you cast fear, then you can pull it off
doustin wrote:There are too many nosense posts here and i have already replied to all questions here, i see many trolling here. I just will say again the obvious, check OP battles and you will see what is there, almost all nukers and healers, so you can say whatever you want cause the facts are there. So keep trolling yourselves i wont participate anymore in the flame you try to make.
I have said it once and ill say it again.
There is a reason that there are tons of eles and healers at OP battles. It is because if they all decided to equip melee gear they would die quick as they probably havent levelled melee high enough.
Melee requires alot of time and patience and i know too many people that give up and go down the mage route because its faster.
Now I know that what i have said is a massive generalisation and that many people who are mages also make it to master melee. Yet i think the percentage of people who dont will outweigh this.
In short... you see more mages at OP battles because its easier to become a high levelled mage than a high levelled melee.
alibasil wrote:I have said it once and ill say it again.
There is a reason that there are tons of eles and healers at OP battles. It is because if they all decided to equip melee gear they would die quick as they probably havent levelled melee high enough.
Melee requires alot of time and patience and i know too many people that give up and go down the mage route because its faster.
Now I know that what i have said is a massive generalisation and that many people who are mages also make it to master melee. Yet i think the percentage of people who dont will outweigh this.
In short... you see more mages at OP battles because its easier to become a high levelled mage than a high levelled melee.
[/massive generalisation]
not to mention the quick switch from nuking to healing when losing, or visa versa when winning. melee does have its place in OP battles, make an organised team of ONLY melee`s and healers, this should be fun.
you are wrong that melee has no place, no one is trolling here, read the posts with an open mind, maybee you`ll learn something and pick up some tips
Boy, I have to laugh at the guy that started this thread.
I don't play as much as some of the folk on here, and don't have multiple skills at 250. But damn, I would NEVER give up my melee.
Generally, if we're into something nasty, I'm the healer. That's my one 250 skill, and I'm told I'm pretty good at it. But I'm not always the healer....
I've been working 2 melee branches up in tandem: 1h sword and dagger. 1h's at 216, dagger's at 198 right now. Now, I don't duel a lot, but we piss about in guild some, and I've tried my luck at a couple of high level elementalist guildies. Never had PvP grade jewels on for 'em, either. Oh, and I live in MA when meleeing, so I have a "mere" 5K hp. Anyone want to take bets on the winner?
......Bueller? Bueller?
Yeah. Me. Why? Think on this: A double nuke takes 3 seconds. With 100/100 amps, it's 1.5 seconds. Hey, how fast is a 1h sword? Mmmmm... just about exactly right to interrupt EVERY SINGLE CAST. Tack on that weenie second hit from the dagger, too. Nuker goes airborne.... *WHACK* nuker tries again.... *WHACK*
So I went to some assorted OP fights. Seems Doustin's all about the OP, right? Well, let me tell you, as a healer, you tend to get pretty focussed on what you're doing, where your teamies are, their status, occasionally trying to res a non-teamie in a mob of bodies that makes targeting a nightmare, yadda yadda. Enough to not notice that guy that left the OP, circled wide around the fight, and suddenly got stuck into some poor healer's back. Guess whose casts are getting interrupted every single time? Oh, and healer-boy, hope you can afford to lose 700+ hp 39 times a minute...
You don't even need to kill him. You just need to foul him up. A 250 caster's got a bomb that hits 8 targets. For as long as you whack on that healer, there's 8 people not getting the benefit of said healer. Sure, he can pop aura. Fine. Move 11 meters and hit someone else.
Now multiply that by 4-5 melee loose in your back ranks. Yeah, you can kill 4-5 people fairly quick, but guess what? you're off the front line while you're doing it...
And then there's the benefit of running about in harvest gear with 2300 hp (2600 for a 250 melee), all those extra hp to power spells, bigger melee aura, 2600 hp self heals, and a host of other wee things that make the hairy end of Atys more survivable.
Oh yeah, and I second or fifth the comment about tanking purple bosses sans melee tank. Again, as a healer, I LOVE HA tanks. They can take a beating like nothing else, and I can be confident I'm not going to get tied up in a high-cost yoyo fest trying to repeatedly res some nuker "tank" while the rest of the party's living on secondary healers/cross-healing. One bobble/failed heal/misread of the situation and it's wipe time. My personal hands-down FAVORITE is a HA/shield/1h spear tank. I love a tank with well over 6K hp, and when the shield works, something like 75%/850 max damage absorb. Oh, and stupidly high parry ratings that have the 270 mob killing nothing but air half the time... (Ever seen a tank with 300 parry? WOW!)
And lastly: I have FUN tanking. You know this word, Doustin? The reason I'm playing Ryzom? The one that trumps everything else?
grendel1 wrote:Yeah. Me. Why? Think on this: A double nuke takes 3 seconds. With 100/100 amps, it's 1.5 seconds. Hey, how fast is a 1h sword? Mmmmm... just about exactly right to interrupt EVERY SINGLE CAST. Tack on that weenie second hit from the dagger, too. Nuker goes airborne.... *WHACK* nuker tries again.... *WHACK*
Yep this is another reason that melees are vital in big fights that we had forgotten to mention. Even my 32 hpm as a heavy melee is enough to cause some serious issues for any casters.
The only issue that this style of melee fighting can stumble over is when the distance between the two front lines is quite far. Melees that run for the healers but dont have their own healing backup can often be dead sometimes before they even make it. In this situation i usually opt to defend my own healer line from the advancing opposition melee
doustin wrote:There are too many nosense posts here and i have already replied to all questions here, i see many trolling here. I just will say again the obvious, check OP battles and you will see what is there, almost all nukers and healers, so you can say whatever you want cause the facts are there. So keep trolling yourselves i wont participate anymore in the flame you try to make.
I think there s nothing to say to guys like you and i will stop wasting my time.
You start this post with the feeling you are right and you think you probably know more on the game than the oldest players.
It s kinda funny to see you can troll and flame your own post.
grendel1 wrote:Oh yeah, and I second or fifth the comment about tanking purple bosses sans melee tank. Again, as a healer, I LOVE HA tanks. They can take a beating like nothing else, and I can be confident I'm not going to get tied up in a high-cost yoyo fest trying to repeatedly res some nuker "tank" while the rest of the party's living on secondary healers/cross-healing. One bobble/failed heal/misread of the situation and it's wipe time. My personal hands-down FAVORITE is a HA/shield/1h spear tank. I love a tank with well over 6K hp, and when the shield works, something like 75%/850 max damage absorb. Oh, and stupidly high parry ratings that have the 270 mob killing nothing but air half the time... (Ever seen a tank with 300 parry? WOW!)
I have to agree, I'm somewhat new, only have one skill > 150 (multiple > 100 tho) but the night I *just* got to 125 Healing we went after Great Najaabs, 'we' was Grendel and myself, alone. We had one or two close calls, usually me being out of SAP/HP to cast and hadn't used my self heal yet, and I decided to pray they didn't use their special attack twice in a row -- but that was only a couple in 2 hours of fighting them in a two man team.
I've teamed with as healer for a lot of AoD's, there's no way we can do that without either a tank or more healers, the AoD if that's their only high level skill just plain doesn't have enough HPs, even if they also have the HPs from melee, they just can't get enough casts while somethign that big is chewing on them fast enough without a tank or more healers. Maybe someone who is strong in both afflictions and ele can do it (keep fearing them away long enough to heal the healer between), but I think there's a lot of advantage to the melee as it is.
I know I could be a better healer than I am, but I really think that there's mobs a tank can handle better than an elementalist, or even better, a mixed team is going to have better results...
or slow hitting mobs (like "normal" plods 
