Zorai is dead

[svayvti]

There have been plenty of actions taken by our guild, not asking for them because for the long run of the game it doesn't make a difference.

Though Raynes and the fanbois want to attack anyone who disagrees with their ideological state of Ryzom, the truth in Zorai lands isn't good. Sure, spin all you want because nobody should say anything can possibly be wrong with your perfect game. A few of you can be as "dedicated" as you want, it just means you'll be the last fools wasting time when the lights get turned out.

In reality no game is perfect, and this one has some serious issues that look likely to doom Zorai at least if not the entire game. Zorai were popular in the first place. There were easily 4 times as many people on in Zorai lands pre-patch 1 at any given time, plus many more players as many of those were casual players.

Raynes grow up, why do you so childishly attack every other Zorai guild? I think I speak for just about everyone in Zorai lands who isn't in your guild kissing your rear when can you please stop being a pain in the ass to everyone in the game and on the forums? Sorry the game story, exploration, other guilds, your lack of willingness to travel and learn for yourself, other people having more levels than you, whine, whine, etc, etc doesn't meet your expectations. Get over it.

Jesdyr has it right, let me elaborate more. Ryzom is a community based game and needs a certain "x" (for those of you who can handle algebra) number of people to fill the roles in the game. Not just mage/fighter, but all the sub-roles which are really need to be viable and effective at higher levels. Pike crafters, sword crafters, amp crafters, heavy armor crafters, medium armor crafters, light armor crafters, ammo crafters, axe crafters, jewelry crafters, launcher crafters... oops I hit the 10 population limit of Zorai lands... no room for anything else like foragers or blinders, etc.

Yes we can hold events, form hunting teams, etc as a guild. However, we can not recruit the large numbers of people required to keep each civilization afloat in this game. That would be Zorai for you "devil may care" attitudes in other civilizations, you needn't bother posting if you have no knowledge of the civ's situation. Without a good influx of people (and talking more than 30 on newbie island) to Ryzom either returning, becoming more active, or joining fresh then I just don't see how Witherings can stay viable.

I'll give a few more recommendations since Nevrax has refused the simple steps of communication with their customers and undoing the damage they did with patch 1.

They could and probably should relocate all Zorai to Burning Desert. Have Zorai start there as exiles and move everyone currently in witherings. It would give the necessary population in a pro-Kami setting.

Thanks to Xmancer for trying to be constructive, "want to buy many more of you, Dapper not an issue".

[zzeii]

I'll give a few more recommendations since Nevrax has refused the simple steps of communication with their customers and undoing the damage they did with patch 1.

What do you call the last 2 weeks of patchs? With Cerest(NA) and Lawrence(Euro-Eng) posting on the boards about the upcoming patches? Is that not undoing damage and communication? Or did you have something more specific in mind?

Yes Raynes hasn't had a pretty history, but recently (past day or so) he has toned down his posts. Less flame, and more constructiveness to them. And you are just flaming him and anyone else who doesn't follow your 'DOOM DOOM DOOM' philosophy about the zorai. To quote the Dead 50s 'Life isn't about what you've done, it's about what you're doing.'

You are the one painting a negative picture now and doing nothing about it. You aren't even trying. I suggested for your guild to hunt together, as a guild at a scheduled time for you all to give it a go. If you can't have fun with something like that, then maybe your guild wasn't as tight-knit as you thought. Maybe you all truly can't enjoy Ryzom anymore, and should move on to something else. I WELCOME YOU TO PROVE ME WRONG!

When you refuse to try, that's when things become impossible, because you make them so. Has nothing to do with the game at that point. Raynes is beginning to see this(I think, just a guess, and no offense intended raynes), why can't you?

[raynes]

Though Raynes and the fanbois want to attack anyone who disagrees with their ideological state of Ryzom, the truth in Zorai lands isn't good. Sure, spin all you want because nobody should say anything can possibly be wrong with your perfect game. A few of you can be as "dedicated" as you want, it just means you'll be the last fools wasting time when the lights get turned out.

You don't think that I know there are problems with the game right now? You don't think I know that the game population is on the low side? I play the game daily, I know what is going on. The difference is that instead of *****ing about it non-stop, instead of spending large amounts of time crying and whining about how a patch ruined everything, I have taken steps to get more people in the game. I have taken the time to go to the noob islands and help people if they need it. I take the time to go into the question section of this board and answer anyones questions if I can. I have gone to other boards I visit and posted about this game. Three of which are a gay gamers board, the former Earth and Beyond board, and mmorpg.com. I know of at least 3 people that have tried the game and plan on staying because of my recomendation. You might say it's only 3 people, but if everyone in the game got three more people it would be a huge improvement.

See that's the difference between you and I. You do nothing but ***** about how the game is ruined, how no one plays it, but you don't do a damn thing to correct the problem. You want more people to play? Then go out and get more people to play. You want Witherings to have more players? Then stop posting things that push people away.

Raynes grow up, why do you so childishly attack every other Zorai guild? I think I speak for just about everyone in Zorai lands who isn't in your guild kissing your rear when can you please stop being a pain in the ass to everyone in the game and on the forums? Sorry the game story, exploration, other guilds, your lack of willingness to travel and learn for yourself, other people having more levels than you, whine, whine, etc, etc doesn't meet your expectations. Get over it.

First off, no one kisses my rear. Second of all I am hardly a pain in the ass to everyone. In fact I think you would find that many players in game see me as friendly and very helpful. The reality is that a handful of people dislike me. Those just happen to be the leaders of the larger Zorai guilds an a few of their members. And their dislike for me is simply because I disagree with them on most topics. The view is that if you don't go along and agree, then you are a trouble maker, pain in the ass, and not a good player.

Finally I have no clue what you are talking about with me whining about levels and saying I have a lack of willingness to travel and learn things. Ask my guild about my willingness to travel. Ask them how much I know about Witherings, the tribes in it, and the landmarks in it. Just because I have choose to spend my game time learning the homeland of my character instead of going to other lands, does not mean I don't want to travel and learn things for myself.

[tinpony]

Though Raynes and the fanbois want to attack anyone who disagrees with their ideological state of Ryzom, the truth in Zorai lands isn't good. Sure, spin all you want because nobody should say anything can possibly be wrong with your perfect game. A few of you can be as "dedicated" as you want, it just means you'll be the last fools wasting time when the lights get turned out.

In reality no game is perfect, and this one has some serious issues that look likely to doom Zorai at least if not the entire game. Zorai were popular in the first place. There were easily 4 times as many people on in Zorai lands pre-patch 1 at any given time, plus many more players as many of those were casual players.

I don't understand why you feel the need to attack people for disagreeing with you. Liking a game doesn't make me a fanboi anymore than your dislike of the game makes you a troll. No-one disputes that there are problems with the game, such as missing content and the difficulty for some mobs and the difficulty for mages solo. Yet, I see that 95% of the problems with game mechanics that patch one caused have been moderated and I am waiting for the rest to come. I'm embarrassed to say that some of the GMs know me by sight because of the number of bug-reports or suggestions I file. Like most people here, I won't play indefinitely with the game in the state it is in right now, but like a lot of other people, I am enjoying the game right now.

Secondly, my friends list is about 6 times longer now than it was prepatch. I was not and am not now in a guild. Prepatch, (and there is nothing wrong with this) the guilds were so tight that they hunted together, they talked together, they supplied each other with mats and goods and were utterly self-sufficient. Again, nothing wrong with that, that's the point of guilds. To a non-guild player, they really had no use for me.

However, post-patch with a lot of people leaving, the guilds started looking outward and a real sense of community has developed. You're more likely to get a pick-up group or chat with someone new or just even saying hello by the stables. People whom I have seen since the beginning of the game are chatting around and saying hi. For those who stayed post-patch, the game is really on a high note if they chose to make it such. Even with the guilds largely self-sufficient again, the community spirit remains.

Pre-patch, I found myself staying in Pyr and Fyros a lot. The population in any zone there was easily double, or triple the Zorai populationon on any given night. Selling things went so fast. I went from being a dirt poor crafter scraping by to having millions of dappers in a week. We actually received in game emails wondering when we were coming back to Pyr. I don't know what you were seeing, but I could go days without seeing another soul in Zora pre-patch. Sitting in Dementia or Void prepatch was a lonely, lonely experience.

I was grouped a couple days back with a former blinder mage who was so surprised by the areas in Haven where we were hunting. He said how they had bypassed those areas completely with blind and ws now re-exploring the game in a whole new light.

In fact, there were whole times in group with six or seven of us where we worked for a goal that got us no XP, but just to see what happened. Or when we went exploring, just to see the sights. Or we went challenging ourselves to get a teleport ticket. From my perspective, I didn't think other people did that and it was cool as all get out that the things I've always loved about the game solo or duo were also of interest to other people.

I think that even without patch one, a lot of people would have left anyway with EQ and WoW coming out. We would have seen a huge drop in it anyway. Also, and I've said this before, nothing increases negativity like negativity. The one time I grouped with a complainer group, I logged out ready to quit myself. I got back online and grouped with different people and was astounded at the change in my attitude.

I'm sorry that you dislike the game so much. I hope you find one you like.

Tin.

[xmancer]

And the question is what are some ideas to do that?

And i was in fact typing in such things immediately after the post... (bottom page 4 this thread is where it landed) two pages later and not a single comment from you or zzei or anybody.

[zzeii]

And i was in fact typing in such things immediately after the post... (bottom page 4 this thread is where it landed) two pages later and not a single comment from you or zzei or anybody.

Interesting concepts, but could lead to complaints from other races, as well as people just porting around til they find the low pop place of the day. Or switching toons to take advantage of the situation (transfering all the phat lewt to a noober/mule char just to get a better price).

Good ideas, but possibly exploitable . And I'm sure everyone knows those 3kxp a kill junkies would be jumping to wherever the xp is 'hot' at the moment.

The skill bonus would encourage zorai to hunt at home, but would then further detract them from going out into the world as well. And I could see people hoppin civs/chars just to have the best hunting ability as the populations fluxuate.

Good job on posting constructive suggestions though. Sorry I couldn't flame you, but if you really want one, here it is: <insert obligatory flaming comment about xmancer here>!!!!!11!!!one!!!1three!!!1111..1.11.

[raynes]

And i was in fact typing in such things immediately after the post... (bottom page 4 this thread is where it landed) two pages later and not a single comment from you or zzei or anybody.

Sorry you got lost in the shuffle there. I went back and read your suggestions and I can't really agree with them (big suprise huh? ). I really don't think putting an xp incentive is a good solution. What happens when the least popular race is no longer the least popular. I see one of two possibilities. The first being that people will just switch races again to the least popular race. The second that you will hear nerf for miles around becuase a bonus they were once getting, they no longer get.

The solution has to lie in changes/adjustments to the race itself. If that be the introduction of special skill that are race specific (Zorai having the ability to use magic for stealth, Tryker dive, Matis grow and develop new mats, Fryos being able to fly), having equipment and items that are race specific, or giving certain races the ability to fight things better. They have to be changes that aren't dependant on how popular the race is.

As I pointed out before, better customization of the Zorai masks would be a huge help also.

[xmancer]

Interesting concepts, but could lead to complaints from other races, as well as people just porting around til they find the low pop place of the day.

not sure about the complaints. I've seen it done well in games where races are at war with eachother and viciously competing, and we arent doing that here...i guess thats because folks have learned the world is *richer* if things are roughly balanced

as far as bouncing around - thats why i specified groups should be 50%+ native. those are the folks that NEED help getting groups. The idea is to incent foreign players to get in there and help them.

Transferring loot - dont forget that gear has stat requirements, except jewels, and i'm sure thats gonna change.

Or switching toons to take advantage of the situation (transfering all the phat lewt to a noober/mule char just to get a better price). Good ideas, but possibly exploitable .

Ooh! good point... the buy/sell price thing is best chucked. i hadnt thought of the exploit angle. Still making goods more widely accessible seems viable -makes it just a little easier for crafters to buy and harvesters to sell. I guess people could then port in, buy, and port out.... but they can do that now, porting into the city with goods of the correct level.

And I'm sure everyone knows those 3kxp a kill junkies would be jumping to wherever the xp is 'hot' at the moment.

they still need half native group the way i stated it...

again the idea is to incent people to (a) play whatever race gets *really* imbalanced and (b) incent people to help that race... if the pop is low enough, the xp hounds wont be able to all get into groups with 50% needed race...

The skill bonus would encourage zorai to hunt at home, but would then further detract them from going out into the world as well. And I could see people hoppin civs/chars just to have the best hunting ability as the populations fluxuate.

Thats why i suggested a bonus that decreased as levels went up.... but i wasnt that explicit. its the poor sub-50s that cant GET to foreign lands that need the big help. maybe half that for the 50-100 crowd, and nothing for folks big enough.

And by incenting low pops, i'm not talking when things are 10-25% out of whack. Its when one race gets 40%, 50%, 60% below the other 3 that things get hairy and i think steps need to be taken. So it shouldnt fluxtuate that much.

And if people want to run multiple toons to take advantage of this.... really is there that much harm? even if they got 20% extra XP, if they split time 50/50 between two races each one is still only advancing at 55% of normal rate for the amount of time played... *shrug* (since only one race would get bonus)

as for Raynes comments - If you dont put in temporary measures to help balance pops, it wont happen. Everything you suggest is good but... since they are all *permanent* changes then if it works to draw people in, then it will continue to do so even afetr things balance.... creating an imbalance in the other direction.

[zzeii]

(b) incent people to help that race...

I'd be more worried about using that race, instead of helping...

And this would give an advantage to those who play Zorai already, now they (and their friends) can level faster than everyone else already in game, causing zorai to play favorites and people playing buddy~buddy with zorai just to get that xp bonus. Now all those that can travel to zorai will bring their toons there to level. And now all those new people coming in to matis/fyros/tryker lands will see low region pops because others are hunting elsewhere.

Giving a civ an xp advantage will not solve population problems. Even with the mats still skewed to all #%#$!@g @$%@ in tryker, people still play tryker because they like the civ. So it's not the territorial benefits that draw the players, its the civilization that draws the players to play tryker/matis/fyros/zorai.

Placing fame-based pricing back in for selling/buying would help draw existing zorai back.

Honestly, it falls on the players more than anything. Having inter-civilization trips will help, as will having more zorai who can hunt elsewhere, hunt at home. The zorai need to encourage hunting groups to come to their lands, instead of leaving it to hunt elsewhere. I'm not familiar with the hunting grounds that well being tryker. So I can't exactly suggest where to hunt in The Witherings. Whereas those zorai who do have friends from elsewhere, can and should encourage people to hunt in their lands. Show them around, hunt in various spots. Actually found an awesome place to level skills 70-100+ really easy, no aggro mobs, very little link mobs, and it was right outside of Zora! I sure as heck know that trykers and matis do not have this luxery, and I'm pretty sure even the fyros aren't this lucky for those levels, or they have to cross some dangerous places to do it.

Instead of posting how its dead, or trying to get civilization 'perks' for being low pop, sell the idea of hunting in your lands. I'm sure there are other great hunting/foraging spots that I do not know about (especially considering I know very little). Crossing BB is a breeze nowadays, and there are people willing to help out if you ask. And i'm sure there are some tryker who would love to come and play in The Witherings, and its a heck of alot easier making it there than to the Majestic Gardens.

[svayvti]

I don't understand why you feel the need to attack people for disagreeing with you.

Actually most of this last page seems to be tag team attacks from Raynes and Zzeii in their usual zeal to condemn those with a different viewpoint.

Obviously showing by them, they don't care enough about the issue to really do much about it and neither do most of the others here.

If you do care about the Zorai playing community still and would like to do something about it however, do please let me know. Some of us still care plenty about the community and it amounts to more than just Raynes whining endlessly about other guilds events and doing things he won't try. Zzeii's ignorance about our guild is just as annoying.

Anyways Zzeii I dare you to put your money where your mouth is and go to Zorai. Or are you just all hot air on the forums?