Ryzom

clearly you should be able to kill anyone at any time to make it fair

amitst wrote:clearly you should be able to kill anyone at any time to make it fair

but what about spawn killing? thats not really fair

(OOC:

The situation I think this is all in response to is the one Nillian described. However there is a bit of difference between one person respawning in the middle of their enemy and goading them into killing her when they didn't leave the spot after about 30s and a team of people dropping the respawners as soon as they pop, over and over again.

Audrey also rezzed incoming OP defenders (when she was left alone) and then attacked from the rear with them. So it was a win-win situation for her, she gets an excuse for people to do far 'worse' spawn-camping in return AND gets to initiate an attack from the rear.

I guess what the attacking force should have done was use a ticket to Heretics Hovel, regroup and clear the spawn point although getting through the portal would be difficult. Although then the defenders could just respawn there and the situation wouldn't be much better. A 15 minute walk from Fairhaven is a bit much.

That outpost is in a tough position for Neutrals to attack, not sure where the Kami tp is though. I don't know how the portal could be made a safe zone, there are already that many different timers and flags will another PVP layer even work? I'm sure a tactician like Audrey would have half the defending army go to the portal if it was safe then leave it en-masse. I think Nevrax need to think long and hard about any solution.

That said, it is sad that this situation occured though and it was only a few people doing it. I would have preferred to have had another crack at attacking the outpost than have to wait for a GM to step in, and I think the many people waiting patiently defending would have preferred that too.

For me there wasn't a lot of emotional investment in the outcome of this battle, I was just enjoying the fight. Can we all be a bit more sporting next time please?, this was the only blemish on the evening.
)

I do not engage in PvP all that often, but when I do I realize there are often a lot of "emotions" for those participating. Sometimes, things get "out-of-hand" without even realizing it.

I'm not going to profess that I have the answers for everyone, and I am also not going to dictate to others what should or should not be "permitted" - I feel that can only come from the Devs.

For myself, however, I will stick to my own "Rules of Engagement":

1. I will not respawn-kill, nor heal anyone who is killing homins at respawns.
2. I will not TP kill.
3. I will not stand in the safety of the TP and heal comrades (though I have been guilty of doing this once or twice - I will not do it in the future).
3a. The only exception to this "rule" is that I may rez a comrade that is close to the TP/Respawn and is only trying to get *to* the TP in order for us to regroup and decide upon a plan of action.
4. I will not kill homins that I know to be "afk" more than once
4a. I will expect to be killed if I am afk in an "unprotected" area with pvp tags on.
5. I will cease my current pvp battling if anyone I am fighting alongside with does any of the above (with the exception of 3a and 4a).

As for name-calling and trash-talking I *think* that most of the homins I have seen doing this (and also those that are the target of such) know that it is usually just "RP" and nothing personal. A certain amount of trash-talking is expected in any PvP and frankly I find quite a lot of it amusing. I do not engage in it myself, but again, that is just my personal choice.


Recently there was an FvF engagement in Void. The Kara team got wiped and we all had to respawn and when we TP'd back in to Void, we were met with several Kami "camping" the Kara TP. They began attacking us as soon as we ported in, and didn't leave us much choice in healing/rezzing each other *at* the TP. As if this was not disappointing enough, I left the battle when I turned around a few minutes later and saw 5 "dead" Kami's right next to the Kara TP.

My moral question is: Should Kara TP's be safe-zones for Kami? Were the Kara's that killed the Kami's right next to it in the wrong - or were they protecting their own TP? The same should be asked about Kami TP's.

My other question is: How much of an area around TP's are supposedly safe-zones? I personally was killed within 10m of the TP (over and over).

maybe a 20 second warmdown after porting somewhere whereby you cant get ganked.

and if you had just died you have a warmdown that lasts the duration of your hp/sap/stam regen? of course this could be limited to an area so that should you leave the zone you are auto-tagged again.


Just some thoughts...

alibasil wrote:maybe a 20 second warmdown after porting somewhere whereby you cant get ganked.

after porting / respawning, you should be protected from pvp untill you make your first move, THEN 20 sec / 10 sec countdown should start.

porting / spawning can take _very long time_.

This may have been proposed already but,

When you spawn or port you are invulnerable until you take any sort of action.

i.e. you could stand still and heal up then hit inv or whatever to take your chances if the spawnpoint is overun or you could simply port out again somwhere else if the spawnpoint looks hopelessly overrun and you dont want to take your chances.

This would stop pointless greifing res-killing but would not care-bear the event by removing the occupation of a spawn point as a legitimate tactic of war if you had the numbers or the inclination to do so.


(edit doh, very similar to previous post but dont agree on cooldown you can run a long way in 10/20 secs and would remove the advantage of occupying the spawn as somone may be able to use it to rejoin there main force)

norvic wrote:(edit doh, very similar to previous post but dont agree on cooldown you can run a long way in 10/20 secs and would remove the advantage of occupying the spawn as somone may be able to use it to rejoin there main force)

Thats why i mentioned the warmdown ceasing as soon as you left the zone of respawn/teleportation because we dont need something else that can be exploited.

norvic wrote:edit doh, very similar to previous post but dont agree on cooldown you can run a long way in 10/20 secs and would remove the advantage of occupying the spawn as somone may be able to use it to rejoin there main force

timer would be mainly there for healing break , as healing should be considered "any action" (as is trying to nuke - cant, timer starts)

only thing you could do is sit down or tp out (and maybe self heals) w/o starting timer and making you open to attack.

uhuhu wrote:Yersterday.. Neva and me respawned in north of Loria.. alot of Kamis there o.o ... Some of them attacked us.. i'll not give any names.. but alot of newbs. so.. i killed them for like 10 mins... after.. one of them.. insulted Neva and me.. (with very bad insult). So.. i just killed some of Kamis.. just for they know what's to be killed when ya spawn. I left them alone after... and they still crying in region.. now.. if ya dun wanna be killed when ya spawn.. dun kill the other too

You justify pinning a whole spawn down for the best part of a quarter of an hour so *nobody* involved in the Whirling attack could muster there because a couple of new players killed you?

Had you not simply kept attacking those players, I'm sure it would be classed as griefing, why is it not when you are entirely indiscriminate?

Your logic also follows a flawed "two wrongs make a right" pattern which only creates more hate, had we retaliated and camped your spawn back rather than letting it go, this could have ascended in to somthing very nasty.

~Kem, making his prescence known on the forums at last

Understand I necro'd the original argument a little, but my point still stands regarding the hate cycle.