Ryzom

badboyz wrote:What happens if someone is a low digger like me. I just got to pulling Q 110 mats and i need a q 230 amps not even omega has that such mat pullers :S and the ppl that can actually dig and craft amp is guild only. If there break the rule there can risk getting kicked out of the guild so even if it is friend or not, dont think anyone will break rules just to craft amp for players.

That's got to be the saddest thing I've ever heard... Guilds with rules against selling to non-guildies!??!

BM's charter:

Rule #1: Have Fun!
Rule #2: Help Others!
Rule #3: There can be no other rules!

It's worked for me for over two years now. Granted we aren't uber or huge or RP fanatics but we've generated a lot of DP in our time!

With the rarity of higher grade mats, the rarity of higher end crafters/diggers/other mat gatherers, and the advent of PVP...I saw this kind of guild versus guild and guild versus other player hoarding coming.

When you have PVP the normal cooperative behavior of some players gets "controled" by others. YES! I think it is beyond sad!

I much prefer regulated economies, personally. But that's not how Ryzom works. Nevertheless, there are many game factors that have deep influences on the market. A "free market" isn't a vacuum, it is defined by many external conditions (resource availability being particularly relevant).

Scant resources will result in more competition and more of a contest for power. Abundant resources will result in more cooperation and more concern with the noncompetitive aspects of the game. I much prefer the latter. Competition, for those who like it, doesn't require scarce resources - in fact, those looking for competition can simply create it. It is much harder to create a collaborative atmosphere when certain people have much more than other people than it is to create a competitive atmosphere when everyone is equal. In fact, I think equal footing makes competition richer (though I prefer board games to PvP video games, so who knows).

But I think the bottom line is Nevrax can't have their cake and eat it too. They need to pick a spot on this continuum - they will never have the benefits of a totally consent-based community game and the benefits of a completely competitive confrontational game. Right now they're combining extreme confrontational and extreme collaborative elements, and it is grinding things to a halt in many cases. Is this meant to be a heavy PvP game? Then I will leave immediately. Is this meant to be a heavy consent/RP game? Then it's more than worth it for me to stick with it. Not knowing is very frustrating.

Thank you Saiwin, you've stated exactly how I feel as well, though much more eloquently than I could.

I was always under the impression that this game was centered more around being generally helpful to each other, with the competition aspects falling more towards who can figure out the best formulas, and therefore make the better equipments (which is a kind of competition I like - Use your brain, not your brawn), but the main goal was always "Kill kitin before it kills you, and battle the Goo".

I was drawn to this game from beta till .. well.. recently. Because there wasn't a PvP focus, it wasn't "kill Bob cuz he knows where stuff is an can beat you to it" like most every other game I've played. It was such a relief to find one that hadn't centered on PvP, as well.. I'm older, I'm a mom, and I've had my fill of the games where the main goals are to be better than Bob, and to beat the snot out of him at every opportunity. SOR had drawn a lot of people like me in the beginning, and we were so amazed that a game finally catered to more than that type.. and now.. I'm left with a bitter taste in my mouth, feeling very misled, intentionally.

I still currently love SOR, but it's lessening with every new way they give us to make Joe want to kill Bob, just because he can.

Morgan, that is exactly what has upset me so lately. The tone of the game has changed. During beta the direction of the game seemed rather plain that it was homin versus kitin and goo and the outposts seemed to be our staging area to fight the enemy.

With the addition of PVP, the tone and direction of the game changed alot. The community, from early open beta until the PVP patch, was open, friendly, cooperative, mostly non confrontational. After PVP there were numerous confrontational troll/flame bait thread.

I will admit I HATE PVP, but then I have yet to find a PVP system that works as intended. I have only seen what I would call "mosh pits" where the higher level poke and grief the lower levels and tactics and skills in game are TOTALLY meaningless.

I have noticed in a few games that once all options and hopes for the game ever fullfilling the "dream" the devs originally had for it fail, they pull out the PVP card. It is as if they say, OH WELL! if we toss PVP in, at least we can get the PVP crowds money. They then point to PVP free for all games and their profits over the years.

All this alienates those that want a game that honors cooperation and strategy, role playing and things of that nature.

A PVP system will only, really work in a game where it's possible, via luck or good equipment, for a total newb to take out am experienced player against the odds.

To get that environment you need to move away from levels, away from massive hit point pools and into a more realistic and deadly system, while still accounting for system lag.

I think it can be done but all MMORPG producers still seem to be stuck on this whole D&D kick of levels and monster hunting. Ryzom is the most progressive MMORPG I've seen but it still caters to these tropes. With development costs what they are companies don't take as many risks as they could.

grimjim wrote:A PVP system will only, really work in a game where it's possible, via luck or good equipment, for a total newb to take out am experienced player against the odds.

To get that environment you need to move away from levels, away from massive hit point pools and into a more realistic and deadly system, while still accounting for system lag.

I totally agree with this. The only MMO that's done it to my knowledge is Planetside, and they were able to do it because of the first person aspect. Personally I don't think any "click once to attack" game can ever move away from levels, it's the only way to balance something so basic.

One thing people tend to forget though is that a group of low level players has a good chance of taking out a higher one in these games. So there in lies the strategy that a lot of people ignore.

systemv wrote:So there in lies the strategy that a lot of people ignore.

Everyone seems to ignore this is true.

My trouble with most PVP systems is that the fights are over so fast that any strategy has to be prediscussed and planned. Even with voice programs it is hard to communicate fast enough when some PVP battles in some games last in the seconds range, not minutes. By the time one of the group says something, it is already too late.

lyrah68 wrote:strategy has to be prediscussed and planned.

and that's bad?