Ryzom

baby1974 wrote:the verry sad turn of events is making a profit off the the ABILITYS that you have over other homins...Karma hunny..my gramere allways said never sell your gifts...maby you should be reviewing and reassesing YOUR views on your core beliefs.

Recommended reading to all of you who think Haddo should be selling his stuff cheap because it's good for you, or that I should be spending hours of my time working up a skill and give the end results away for nothing to people who show neither appreciation nor add value to my existence on Atys:

Ayn Rand, Atlas Shrugged

I have wiccan philosophies Ravens, but also Taoist and Objectivist beliefs.

i feel haddos prices are verry resonable for the effort work and resultes HE acomplishes..you however have taken HIS skills for profit..thats just WRONG if you wana sell YOUR crafts that high BE MY GUEST


you cant pick and choose WHAT you belive when it suits you . if your gonna pick one stick to it... otherwise its just an excuse for bad behavior


Ravens
Member of OmegaV

keoni wrote:Ravens: see the final line of my sig. Consider your core beliefs, as I recall how you related them to me. Then please explain to me in a /tell sometime how you are living up to your beliefs by blindly supporting your guild in this jingoistic exercise. Merry meet... and parted.

Harm none ? Making people pay more for goods, cause you happen to get to them first does them harm.


Also I find it amusing that you are trying to take the high road when your own words clearly show that you are indeed not above it all. I really have to say no one in this thread has has resorted to childish sarcasm or personal attacks/insults but yourself.

keoni wrote:knickers in a bunch over this

keoni wrote:self-righteous people on a crusade

keoni wrote:Get a freakin' life.

keoni wrote:perhaps because you aren't reading very carefully?

keoni wrote:you are exceptionally delusional.

Tetra simply asked how your grinding justifies price gouging on reselling someone elses work? You clearly try to dodge/manipulate the truth when you stated "Homins who put countless hours grinding to fill a market need should not be lambasted for pricing the end result at a profit." There is not one person in here except your guildmate (stated people are unhappy with haddo's prices) questions a crafter's pricing. People upset at you are not upset about your crafts but the reselling of another crafter's goods at a greatly inflated price.

keoni wrote:I speak only for myself, and not my guild.

keoni wrote:That's not an option, Basic. You are either in a guild war, OmegaV (and whoever they can enlist as allies) vs. OD (and our allies), over this ridiculous non-issue, or you are not..

How come you are allowed to speak for yourself and Basic is not? He states that he will take on your guild but you seem to have a double standard here.

keoni wrote:I happen to have been one of the very few homins willing to fill the market need created by Haddo's absense by crafting and selling at reasonable markup decent HP jewelry?.

keoni wrote:my attempt to assist Haddo fill the demand for HP jewelry

Buying his jewelry and marking it up is not really helping increase the supply or assisting him... who do you think your fooling? Why all the dodging of questions and the repeated attempts to divert attention from the core issue of you price gouging some poor homin? Why are you trying to paint yourself as some nice autristic person who is a victim? Your actions and words clearly show you are not.

marct wrote:OK, Here it is Plain and simple.

1. If you are a repeated Black Market Hawker, OmegaV will not stand for it.
2. You may become Kill on Sight (KoS)
3. You will not receive OmegaV support through goods or assistance.

If you were only 2 rings, I think you have nothing to worry about. If you are looking to increase your dapp account instead of supporting the community then worry. You are not only a dis-service in this case to the original crafter and there price point, but you are doing a dis-service to the game and community development.

And, yes I am an OmegaV officer.

Ummm, shouldn't everyone wait and talk to Haddo before all hell breaks loose. I mean roninpvp posted and this is the basis of the thread:

Those persons buying all of Haldo's Jewlery then marking them up and reselling them are unbelievable. SHAME ON YOU PEOPLE! Anybody buying another crafters goods and selling them at higher prices are lame.

It is a free market to a certain point, and this goes for a number of mmogs I've played with in game economies, that it is a general unspoken rule that you don't resell the crafter's wares in the same market, and one generally asks the crafter for permission as a curteousy if they can resell said wares in other markets. I would say that in other cases a crafter and/or guild states that their are certain rules about the reselling of their goods and if they catch a person(s) certain actions might be taken against said person(s). Haddo did state that he did not want his wares resold in the Fyros market, and I can't remember what guild Haddo is in, but wouldn't it be the responsibility of Haddo and the guild he is in to decide on what is going to be done since his wares are the ones involved, unless he and the guild he is in has authorized others to make decisions on his and their behalf. That is why I think any determinations and judgements should be postponed till all parties involved have a chance to sit down and talk about it, Haddo included.

Keoni doesn't seem to be the main one doing this. I haven't seen any jewelry being resold by her although she has stated that she has sold a few pieces, two rings I believe. The main perp, and I forget his or her name or if they were a member of a guild, that I saw that was reselling Haddo's wares in Fyros and jacked up prices, had many, many pieces that were marked up, but it wasn't Keoni.

If you guys want to start some clan wars over this, be my guest, but it seems to be a rushed judgement in my opinion. I'm not saying you're wrong members of OmegaV and members of the Order of the Dragon, but I would just think it would be more prudent to wait till Haddo's return to hash this out. One thing though, I just hope this KOS policy does not apply to Joe's Hotdogs and Bagpipe Emporium and Rundll as I know for a fact that he talked with Haddo and got his permission to sell in other markets besides Fyros.

[QUOTE=baby1974\ou cant pick and choose WHAT you belive when it suits you . if your gonna pick one stick to it... otherwise its just an excuse for bad behavior[/QUOTE]

And those who exhibit bad behaviour should be hunted harrased and killed, is that what you are saying Ravens? That OmegaV is justified in starting a war over the resale of two rings? That OmegaV is the judge, jury, and executioner, defenders of all the poor wittle downtrodden on Atys? That they can puff themselves up, stand on their collective soapbox, and channel Haddo's spirit and speak for him when he's not around?

This is all so very, very retarded. First we have the server delete our guild with zero compensation from the GM's, then when we're minding our own farking business trying to rebuild, we get a bunch of holier-than-thou Crusaders declaring war on us over exactly nothing.

Well you know what? I'm not playing that game and I'm going to encourage my guildmates not to play it either. OD doesn't currently operate much if at all in PvP zones, so there's close to squat you can do. If you train mobs against us in non-PvP zones, we will file complaints with the GMs.

So: assemble your kindling to burn the wicked at the stake if that turns you on - but don't be too disappointed when we don't show up for the bonfire.

ok for ONE OMEGAV did NOT declare war on OD..Basic stated HIS opinon and it was validated by MANY MANY ppl here...YOU declared that it was ALL or nothing.. again you "speek for your guild" when you claim not to ...
Then when I voice MY suport over what I feel to be a valid issue you attack ME personaly....
sit down
slow down
calm down
and get over it

everyone has their own opinons and there isnt anything you can do about it

Ravens
speeking for ME

so you basically admit to jacking the prices.... no compensation.. we are rebuiling.. I.E. i buy haddos stuff KNOWING hes not around jack the price and profit to replace the hall/items you lost..

i appreciate the clarifacation

roninpvp wrote:Why are you trying to paint yourself as some nice autristic person who is a victim? Your actions and words clearly show you are not.

I'm not altruistic. Nor do I suffer fools gladly, and that comes across in my phrasing when I believe someone is being wrong-headed, childish, or just plain retarded on a subject. Here's the difference, though, between myself and OmegaV's cadre: I believe that the forums are here to provide an exchange of views, and let those who are reading decide who's right and who's wrong. If you disagree with me here, and you say your peace here, that's cool.

OmegaV, it would seem, aren't interested in an exchange of views, they're trolling the forums looking for excuses to start a war, and painting themselves as the Knights in Shining Armor Saving the Downtrodden. Well the downtrodden must be getting hard to find, if marking up a pair of rings is enough justification to Save Them from the Evildoers.

keoni wrote:over the resale of two rings?

You do a good job of climbing up on that cross and nailing yourself to it in most of your posts in this thread... in fact, that's pretty much why I threw out the rest of the garbage in that last post of yours. But the negativity directed towards you is not simply over two rings, it's because of your behaviour and blatant manipulation of the truth in your defense. Nobody cares what you want to do with your own crafted items, people are "attacking" you because of your downright obnoxious behaviour.

First you go out and sell another person's crafted items at a higher price, then when questioned about it you talk about how you have spent countless hours grinding your skills up and should be able to sell your wares at whatever you want. Then when people question what the hell your crafting has to do with buying and reselling another crafter's items at a higher price, and why you are trying to justify that downright foul behaviour... you attack again and claim that people are engaging in a witch hunt. You have done something bad, going on and on about your own crafting and what you sell your own goods for is not going to change that bad behaviour. Going on and on about what you sell your own crafted items for is most certainly not going to make everyone suddenly say "well gee, we were all talking about folks going to a vendor, buying all/a bunch of X, and then turning around to resell them to the same vendor at a higher price... but maybe we should instead talk about how folks should be able to sell their products they craft for what they want"... and none of your misdirection and twisting of the two topics is going to change that fact.

kirk1972 wrote:so you basically admit to jacking the prices.... no compensation.. we are rebuiling.. I.E. i buy haddos stuff KNOWING hes not around jack the price and profit to replace the hall/items you lost..

i appreciate the clarifacation

Clarification: The rings were bought when Haddo was around, for my own spares, when I knew he wasn't going to be on for a week. I bought other spares besides that, but distributed those to my guildmates as theirs blew out.

Clarification: Haddo made many announcements in region about his departure, but if he ever broadcast anything asking people not to resell to Fyros markets I certainly didn't see it.

Clarification: the profit above the price I paid for the rings in the first place: about 150K total. I gave twice that away today to my guildmates to help them buy equipment and such. Costs of the guild crash - replacing guild: 1M. Replacing guild hall: 10M. Balance in guild hall at time of deletion: 1.7M. Value of mats armor and weapons in Hall stores: roughly 4M. How we as a guild have saved up enough to replace most of this already: by harvesting, crafting, and selling *our own wares*.

Does all this clarication matter to you? I sincerely doubt it, but there it is anyhow.