[DEV] The Fame System – Second Edition

[akicks]

I'm sure a few people would be in this situation:
What happens to your apartment if you have -50 fame with the civ where your apartment is?

Sure, you can't go there anymore - but then I should be able to transfer my apartment to a more... hospitable enviroment.

[kgrieve]

I looked at this and I like the idea, just that it doesn't seem to fit with the rest of the game mechanics. At the moment we have the freedom to develop our characters as we see fit. Adding cap values doesn't seem to fit this philosophy.

Most of the mechanics is that it gets harder and harder to reach the higher levels. My suggestion is that it is harder to get fame in opposing races, but still possible to get 100%. That would fit with the existing philosophy while being able to develop as you wish.
Rather than cap the values I would suggest that getting fame with an opposing race is just much harder. For example if you are a Fyros: you work for Fyros fame and get 100% of the fame points, for Tryker fame 30% and for Matis fame get 5% of the fame points.

[philu]

read the text, it's all written there...
if the tryker has fyros citizenship he can join a fyros-based guild
if not he can only join the guild if it's neutral

if the fyros has matis citizenship he can join a matis-based guild
if not he can only join the guild if it's neutral

I did read it again, twice.

It does seem to suggest that. That's OK then.

I still think Nevrax need to respond to some of the concerns raised here.

I have another question regarding this, that definitely doesn't seem to have been answered (or do I need another read?). Will we be able to see the information on cult/nation for other players and other guilds?

Say, for example, someone wanted to play a Fyros who was a staunch Kami supporter. As part of that, this player didn't want to associate with the 'enemy' - i.e. anyone supporting the Karavan. How would they know if someone they were teamed with is a Karavan supporter?

Another example, a player is thinking of joining a guild. Will they be able to find out before thay apply what cult/nation that guild belongs to? Thereby saving themselves the bother if the guild doesn't fit their needs?

There's a mention of titles, but titles can be changed so they're no indicator. I never change mine.

[norvic]

This looks good to me finally some real impact of Fame and the choices you make as to how you play your Char. For sure may need tweaking but about time the politics of Atys had some real impact. Choose your path and take the consequences/benefits the idea of wandering all over with no consequence to your actions has always puzzled me when Kami/Kara and other tensions have always been part of the storyline. Just wandering anywhere always seemed abit woolly to me this should make Atys more of a Dynamic place and people will have to think more in some ways, its not necessarily forcing PvP on people but also forcing RP in which people must put more thought into their character development.

Thumbs up from me.

[michielb]

Sadly this will probably adversely affect the more "liberal" guilds not only will they have to choose one of the three sides in this conflict but the will also have to enforce it amongst their members.



This whole fame buissness raises a few questions though,

Will a guild with a neutral nationality be able to get a guild hall in any city they choose?

What will happens to a guild hall (and it's content) should a guild decide to change nationality?

[gwythion]

The bit I have trouble with understanding the logic of is this:

"Since nations enforce strict rules on citizenship, this has an influence on which guild a given character can join:

* A citizen can only enter a guild of his own nation;
* A neutral character can enter either a neutral guild or a guild with a nation."


I would have expected that this would be the other way round:

* A citizen can enter either a neutral guild or a guild of his own nation;
* A neutral character can only enter a neutral guild.

Surely an unaligned guild is just that, happy to take people of all backgrounds. An aligned guild would only trust those of its alignment.

Can some explain either the RP or game mechanic reason as to why it is as proposed.

[michielb]

The bit I have trouble with understanding the logic of is this:

"Since nations enforce strict rules on citizenship, this has an influence on which guild a given character can join:

* A citizen can only enter a guild of his own nation;
* A neutral character can enter either a neutral guild or a guild with a nation."


I would have expected that this would be the other way round:

* A citizen can enter either a neutral guild or a guild of his own nation;
* A neutral character can only enter a neutral guild.

Surely an unaligned guild is just that, happy to take people of all backgrounds. An aligned guild would only trust those of its alignment.

Can some explain either the RP or game mechanic reason as to why it is as proposed.

As far as I can tell the "neutral" option is stricktly game mechanics: it serves as a go between for the two factions.

Basically you're not supposed to be neutral....

[gwythion]

As far as I can tell the "neutral" option is stricktly game mechanics: it serves as a go between for the two factions.

Basically you're not supposed to be neutral....

I can see that in terms of charcters but not in terms of the relationship between characters and guilds. However I fear that your last bit is the point. It suggests that there is intended to be a close coupling between Guild outposts and the faction war. A coupling that would be undermined if there were to be a large number of neutral guilds.

[petej]

so... be neutral have freedom of movement as before with a slight hit to merchant prices.

or.. side with faction and race lose probably 50% of freedom of movement and trade, oh and have to do rites for this.

So what is the advantage in choosing citizenship and cult? just the privilage to attack a neutral 1st?

Probably to be able to get higher reward Rites (if/when they ever get in game , maybe this is the real reason theyve been withheld so far ?)

[michielb]

I can see that in terms of charcters but not in terms of the relationship between characters and guilds. However I fear that your last bit is the point. It suggests that there is intended to be a close coupling between Guild outposts and the faction war. A coupling that would be undermined if there were to be a large number of neutral guilds.

Allowing for neutral guilds (allowing neutrals to organise themselfs) would result in a "thirt faction" in the conflict potentially splitting Atys up in three "nations" this system therefor undermines my efforts for a Tryker Freestate, making it nothing but mere role play...

More importantly, as you see more of the game mechanics coming up (the fame doc and the new Spires), are you starting to get a clearer vision of how you are going to play the Tryker Freestate? I'm beginning to suspect you're little rebellion isn't fitting into the devs plan. Not that it should stop you; just that we all have to play within the mechanics we're given to a degree.