Do we really need PvP?

[oauitam]

The gun analogy still works pretty well.

No, it doesn't. For reasons far to many to list here, and way off topic.

This is getting a little bit silly. Prior to either of these posts, when we started arguing about what is a good and bad metaphor to use, that's when we wandered off topic. A metaphor is just a quick way into the problem for someone that doesn't quite get what you mean. They shouldn't be confused with the question itself ("do we need PvP") and should be readily discarded if they become distractions.

[As far as "IG != RL"; if it means something more than it's trivial and self-evident truth, I'm not sure what else we can use as a better source of metaphor and analogy than the real life we share in common experience.]

...snip...
Just wondering how it is they seem to encourage you to kill.

Whether they encourage it or not is moot. They enable it. Do we need to enable it?

...snip...
I don't think PvP was designed simply to annoy other people. (...) I think it is ment to give depth, freedom and another layer of compitition to a game.

In MMOs, it hardly ever works.

In other types of games, it works great! But in any game where you spend significant time building up a character or a city, or just trying to get somewhere; if that can be ruined or set back by the acitons of another player, it is going to cause problems. Or, as you rightly put it, "annoy the living p*ss' out of people."

As we have already seen.

[Nothing to add apart from my agreement. Quoted for completeness.]

[sofiaoak]

I think major problem here is that we are asking "Do we really need PvP?".
There is two different kind of PvP, so we should divide it as it is.


Do we need or wanna non-consentual PvP? NO


Do we need or wanna consentual PvP? YES


So talking, requires first that we speek same language.

[oauitam]

A couple of things highly relevant to this thread that I have pulled from here

If we happen to be active in player versus player type of gameplay, this is well within our rights as subscribers to a game allowing that type of functionality.

To put it simply, if you do not wish to engage in PVP, stay out of PVP zones.

My personal belief is that PVP adds much to a game that could otherwise verge on the point of dull.

To clarify, this is what I am hearing consistently and it makes wonder at the real general consensus:

1. Whah whah whah
2. You killed me in a designated pvp zone.
3. Whah whah whah
4. I was digging, minding my own business and you killed me.
5. Whah whah whah
6. You're forcing your type of gameplay on me.
7. Whah whah whah
8. You're nothing but a 13 year old ganker. (very typical to hear this one, though it's almost never true)
9. Whah whah whah
10. Whah whah whah

To make my position clear, I find the word "ganker" to be very derogatory. It sounds somewhat pornographic. Everybody who knows me will probably tell you that I am friendly with just about everybody I meet. Yes, I enjoy PVP, and yes I might just kill you at some point or another. Big deal! You lose absolutely nothing when you die, aside from perhaps a little self-respect.

If Saga of Ryzom were a different game, perhaps we would all live happy, conflict free lives on Atys. However, it has been designed with conflict in mind. By enabling us to battle, designating PVP zones, and creating a conflict between superpowers, Nevrax has made the world that much richer. If you do not wish to participate in PVP, it's not that big a deal. There are several non-PVP areas where you can dig materials from basic to supreme.

The poster seems to hold views different from those that have come to predominate this thread and are woth thinking about.
(I need some sleep before I look at them properly so I'm just putting them here for everybody's reference for now.)

[basicart]

I think major problem here is that we are asking "Do we really need PvP?".
There is two different kind of PvP, so we should divide it as it is.


Do we need or wanna non-consentual PvP? NO


Do we need or wanna consentual PvP? YES


So talking, requires first that we speek same language.

OR

Do we need or wanna non-consentual PvP? YES


Do we need or wanna consentual PvP? NO

[alyssah]

In RL, people who go about putting other people down without prior reason would be considered insecure and lacking self confidence.

Do you think that applies here?

[basicart]

Yes i do thats for sure thats why i used to gank the hell out of thoese that did it

[sofiaoak]

OR

Do we need or wanna non-consentual PvP? YES


Do we need or wanna consentual PvP? NO

Sure, but You do understant what this means for Ryzom and is this really what You wanna for it? I can only say that there isn't much better way to break the current community and replace it with new community.

[basicart]

Iv been playing from Beta1 though theres still some of us out there that would like open PvP and many more that have left allready without waiting for it.
The way i see it at the moment the style of game has been weening out alot of players and Ryzom then disides to try and get back whats been missing from day one "a end game" or "outposts" if you will. Problem is that they have took soooo long to get around to fixing it that if Ryzom then turns into a hardcore PvP game the ones that are still here wont care for it. cos they are mainly the type of peeps that like to have a friendly comunity without conflit.

Then again i could be wayyy off the mark aint slept in 20 hours due to killing alot of other people in other games since the ones here dont care for it much now-a-days

[sofiaoak]

Okey basicart, so basicly You say that current community is not what You wanna and You wanna more pro PvP community with open PvP. I can respect that, but I don't my self ever wanna see it on Ryzom. Mostly because about 70-90% of current player base would have to find new game to play. Of cause game would get a lot of new kind of players. So as business way it's the same, if nevrax has time to wait for new community.

Question is more then, what kind of community nevrax wanna, because both can never be in same game. PvE community with consent PvP community still works on same game, but PvE community with open PvP community will not work.

So thousand dappers question for You basicart is, do You belive nevrax is gonna make Saga of Ryzom to open PvP game on the future?

[defalgar]

sorry to say but that is wrong.
im running a guild in WoW (yes wow ) and we play on a PvP server. we have almost 60 members and about 80% of us are very much pro pvp(as in for pvp not proffesional...) but the other 20% hardly ever pvp's actually never. and they seem to be doing very wel. how the deal wit it? well they just do quests or go hunt for reputation or go and do instances. yes they get killed once in a while but thats part of the game and they dont really mind.
there used to be a guild on our server who was purely PvE and it worked great.

i understand these two games are totally different but still it points out that it is possible. for me anyway.