Ryzom

Pretty much applies to everything at the moment though, sadly. +1

danolt wrote: Do away with it or develop it. The status quo is a failing proposition.

*agrees*
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seawe wrote: While we're at making suggestions, Please remove the top restrictions for fame for Neutrals and make some dapper thing there too

Yeah right. So that being neutral would only bring benefits and absolutely no restrictions anymore. Please give me all that´s good for my char. with no catches attached. Suuuure.... *shakes head*

Neutrals are already able to do more rites (if they work) than those faction aligned. (Appart from those folks that grind-farm-fame to switch, to get the others rites too and then grind back.)
Neutrality should always come at a price and not result in a "win only" situation for those who choose it.
Else everyone would be "neutral" because there´d be no benefit from choosing a faction at all.

CU
Acridiel

seawe wrote: While we're at making suggestions, Please remove the top restrictions for fame for Neutrals and make some dapper thing there too

jwenting wrote: Doesn't matter as you still need allignment for 250 and pr tps. Remove that too and we're talking.
But what would a neutral player get fame with?
Both kara and kami?
Make neutral a viable 3rd alternative, where you don't have to choose sides to not be stunted.

50 is a ridiculously low fame limit firstly. Secondly Tribes should have better 'stuff' for highly valued homins, the higher the better. Tribes should give benefits/perks to players of good standing, neutrals included generally.

The Karavane giving TP access is hypocrisy and was simply given as a game mechanic. This is forced faction choice and already limits players to certain lands and resources. All you who have been blabing that if something like that happened you'd leave, it's already been (kinda) done. Gladly not much. I'm mostly referring to Tribal fames, not Kami/Karavan, it seems faction fame is not limited in either direction up to max...

@Acridiel Being Neutral should of course have limits, if factions were ever developed fully then neutrals wouldn't get special faction quests/items/etc from the Faction... Personally I don't mind the PR restrictions for neutrals, but i think Karavaners are getting unfair treatment considering their 'do not enter' policy .

Forced Duality is boring when its tied to everything good and exciting. Giving player more of a mix and match choice to fit their play styles is all i'm requesting in the end. (and better interacting tribes )

seawe wrote:The Karavane giving TP access is hypocrisy and was simply given as a game mechanic.

Very true, the earlier lore states clearly time and time again that the Karavan forbid homins from entering the PR. It was later retconned into "forbid homins from entering the Deeper PR", because it'd be unfair if Kamists could enter the PR zones while Karavaneers got nothing in return.

We've often brainstormed that it'd be perfect if we'd also had Canopy regions to match the PR regions, and Kamists would be forbidden to enter the Canopy. That way, Karavaneers could be the only ones to get Canopy TPs at the price of being forbidden to enter the PR, Kamists could be the only ones to get PR TPs at the price of forbidden to enter the Canopy, and neutrals would be able to enter both the PR and the Canopy but wouldn't get TPs in either.

That way every option has it's advantages and disadvantages, and it'd actually be hard to chose. Unfortunately we'd need both Canopy and PR zones for that and early Nevrax chose to focus entirely on the PR zones and leave the Canopy as pie in the sky.

canopy zones... i think that must be funny... how tagged diggers at my head blaming me... when i train range weapon skills at them from ground...

In character -

All homins should be united against the Kitin threat, all of this civilization conflict and blind following of false deities will lead us to be easy prey for the real enemy!

OOC -

The tension between uniting for mutual benefit and dividing for selfish or religious squabbling is one of the most interesting things about the story. There should always be uneasiness about how things are, in order to provide something to work toward. I think it would be fine for various story elements to come to life more in game mechanics, just so long as we don't end up with any sort of monoculture. If any side gains too much power such that nobody joins any other side, all of that work will be lost. But I don't foresee such. The pendulum always swings, albeit slowly.

iceaxe68 wrote:In character -

All homins should be united against the Kitin threat, all of this civilization conflict and blind following of false deities will lead us to be easy prey for the real enemy!

Since when you are a Tritonist? (well, someone can argument that tritonists were going to use kitins as allies too, but this is a real obscure piece of atysian history: where is the truth?).

Maybe some of you don't remember that the lore already have some possibility to move the story in different directions. Not sure if actually the Animation team can put these directions as a player choice or they have to choose for us, but sure there is room for many different things in Atys. The story is very open.

As for the neutrals, i generally agree giving them less restrictions, but only if the story justify it.

There is, actually, a couple ways to have neutrals accessing Prime Roots and 'purple' (if this definition still have some sense now, due the misinformation now players have from the 'con' system) regions altars:

first possibility
1. A group of homins (maybe the tritonists or any other group) could, in some way (i leave to the creativity of the devs deciding how), 'learn' how altars work, maybe stealing the knowledge from the karas or the kami, with the ability to add their own altars (not faction related but maybe, related to a different kind of fame, civ or tribe or any other group or even no fame at all) to the high regions.

second possibility
2. civilizations, the more they recover amber cubes, the stronger they became. In this optic, each civilization, in the effort to strenghen their position in the planet, could find a way to steal the altars knoledge from the high powers and build their own altars in the high regions (or any region), giving faction neutrals a different choice in their basket.

Anyway, anything around this argument must be tought twice and more before deciding any change, due to the big impact this can have in the entire story and the planet behaviour in regard of the homins.

I disagree entirely on the idea to have regions (even new one) restricted to specific factions. Anything that restrict game content is always a bad choice in my opinion, expecially in a game, ryzom, built around the concept of freedom.

Instead, restrictions in the ability to use altars or anything else in a region, based on some mechanic involving player actions (pve or pvp doesn't matter), can work pretty well (spires?).

jwenting wrote:you contradict yourself here. You don't want people restricted from areas by design, but you do want the design from enabling players to prevent others from entering areas.

I don't believe that Gilgameesh contradicted himself at all.

gcaldani wrote:I disagree entirely on the idea to have regions (even new one) restricted to specific factions .... Instead, restrictions in the ability to use altars or anything else in a region, based on some mechanic involving player actions (pve or pvp doesn't matter), can work pretty well (spires?).

I have always thought that it would be a good thing for neutral people to work toward getting PR tp's in a different way. Say complete 60% of all the amber cube rites and then you can use a Neutral TP (of course it would have to be comparable to the work that other homins put in to get their 60+ fame).

Being able to access PR is a priviledge, one that has to be earned either by being able to trek through the portals or by working fame of one form or another.