Ryzom

sipanek wrote: If its not worth making the small sacrifice of not going to the old lands how important is it really?

This argument is reaching it's expiry date as global FvF is to be introduced somewhere in the (not so distant?) future...

sipanek wrote:I mean seriously, its not like any honour points rewards will be worth the trouble. They cant let the "winners" get any great advantage, that would be more or less insane. With the small playerbase they really cant afford to alienate the 99% of the players that dont get any serious amounts of honourpoints. And if you cant live without some honorary title, signed coffe mug or whatever they come up with you really dont have the right to complain about getting ganked now and then.

Its all there is, the only significant event there's really been since the Kitin invasion (more so than that since it is shaking up the gameworld and adding new features to the landscape).

This argument doesn't hold water one bit in that context.

Part of the blame lies with Nevrax for not providing, but another portion lies with selfish players whose fun must come at the expense of that of others.

sipanek wrote:I mean seriously, its not like any honour points rewards will be worth the trouble. They cant let the "winners" get any great advantage, that would be more or less insane.

I think everyone with honour points and has bothered with the event should gain some advantage. The winning side should gain an additional one and this has been hinted at. I've spent pretty much every gaming hour in these zones and dug over 30000 mats for no harvest/craft xp (apart from that gained from helpful people from other lands digging my spots). That's almost enough mats to get me to Master Heavy Armourer.

The old event axes were great and didn't require a fraction of this amount of work. If the factions are as generous then there are going to be a lot of homins who didn't take part kicking themselves in a week or so's time (I think you've taken part though).

stijn wrote:Come and dig to the low lvl mats, it's safe, no aggro's and you wont get nuked every 5 mins (happened 2 times in 4 hours yesterday I think)

That is exactly what I've been doing actually. But I can't play during the day cause I'm at work and the avid PVPers are on at night, the same time I am. Thus there are more problems.

bah, actually had a long reply typed out before i decided to reread some posts in this thread. Have to admit i let prejudice do something with my reading skills so i didnt really see what was there the first time.
So here is my second (much lamer) responce.

I pretty much concur with what most people have said here, for the most it still seems pretty respectful and nice out there. There are a couple of people who will always gank as much as possible and it really doesnt matter how much we post about that, it will stay the same.

Even though i have really tried im not sure i can understand how people feel forced to partake in this event. Sure if its the only thing that has happened in ages i understand that you really want a fun event. But if its something you really hate and really want no part of i just dont get it. I get the part about giving it a try, and if its not to bad keep doing it even though you feel things could and should have been done differently. But saying you are forced isnt true. Not just yet anyway, we will see what happens with the outposts etc.

Second part to this is: Ok, i might not get it but some people feel forced to partake even though they hate it. Will any amount of posting change this? Hardly. Post on feedback forums, gather signatures for a petition or organise a peace rally. But telling people they cant play the way Nevrax has asked them to (because really, thats what they have done) wont get any results.

grimjim wrote:We can't force you, we can't 'physically' interdict your play experience in a negative fashion.

You are right that it isn't possible to negative sanction a ganker directly.
The only possible way I imagined for myself, is to meet those players with the same principle outside of FvF/GvG/PvP zones as I do/'have to do' inside that zones: I do not team/hunt with them, I don't buy the stuff they craft, I deny to heal them, or protect them in any other way ( I think you understand the direction I'm heading).

I think some people don't see, that for some other player the FvF/GvG/PvP isn't a game in the game. It is a fraction of the game, and such I'm free to follow the same morale concept everywhere in the game.

But doing so, and encountering these problems in a more roleplaying way, I've been accused of 'childish behavior' and 'overreacting a little' because this be 'only a game', and PvP be something completely different to eg a boss hunt.

So I think the pvp challenge lies there to live with the consequences of ones actions in pvp zones, everywhere and everywhen in the game, and this includes outside of pvp zones. So don't be suprised, if you will be accounted for your doing where you stand and go.

I'm not fundamentally against PvP but I do think that the current implementation is a little flawed. Primarily in that it doesn't really reward the fighters for the right things (protecting harvesters). A fighter that stands guard over harvesters, protecting them from other players AND kitin, won't advance as much as a fighter that runs around nuking all the harvesters from the other side.

Of course, this is ground that's been covered many times but I still think it's an important thing for Nevrax to consider and hopefully address in future events.

Also, I'll take the chance to add a shameless cross-post to my thread with the idea of a dynamic PvP zone that would allow for PvP and non-PvP types to play side by side:

dynamic pvp zone idea

sipanek wrote:bah, actually had a long reply typed out before i decided to reread some posts in this thread. Have to admit i let prejudice do something with my reading skills so i didnt really see what was there the first time.
So here is my second (much lamer) responce.

I pretty much concur with what most people have said here, for the most it still seems pretty respectful and nice out there. There are a couple of people who will always gank as much as possible and it really doesnt matter how much we post about that, it will stay the same.

Even though i have really tried im not sure i can understand how people feel forced to partake in this event. Sure if its the only thing that has happened in ages i understand that you really want a fun event. But if its something you really hate and really want no part of i just dont get it. I get the part about giving it a try, and if its not to bad keep doing it even though you feel things could and should have been done differently. But saying you are forced isnt true. Not just yet anyway, we will see what happens with the outposts etc.

Second part to this is: Ok, i might not get it but some people feel forced to partake even though they hate it. Will any amount of posting change this? Hardly. Post on feedback forums, gather signatures for a petition or organise a peace rally. But telling people they cant play the way Nevrax has asked them to (because really, thats what they have done) wont get any results.

Just to make myself clear. Its not being forced to be involved in the event. But being forced to pvp if we want to be involved in the event. Sorry if I wasn't clear before.


Oh and Trini, I'm completely with you on the repercussions outside the pvp zone.

aylwyne wrote:I'm not fundamentally against PvP but I do think that the current implementation is a little flawed. Primarily in that it doesn't really reward the fighters for the right things (protecting harvesters). A fighter that stands guard over harvesters, protecting them from other players AND kitin, won't advance as much as a fighter that runs around nuking all the harvesters from the other side.

going further offtopic.
Fighters get rewarded for unfair fights, healers are lucky to get rewarded at all. Honor points are awarded if you heal during "combat", same system as xp. So if an opponent is killed between heals, healer gets nothing. if your nuker has magic protection aura up.. and you cant lay a heal spell on them.. you get nothing. if the enemy team targets and kills you as a priority target, you get nothing.

the combat system requires nukers to kill as fast as they can, and healers get ripped off in rewards. The players know how important healers are, why dont the Devs ?

I think a lot of people have failed to see the point I tried to make with my post .

The next few statements are going to seem rather... well, simple, but hopefully that means that everyone is on the same page that I am:

PVP is meant to be challanging.
Challanging pvp is fun.
Killing harvesters is not challanging. (no one has given a reason as to why it is yet).
therefore: killing harvesters is not fun.

Hopefully you can see then what I'm saying is: This event is not fun (from this point of view, I personally am having a blast digging - but that's what I do).

One of the aims the pvp players have (or think they have) is to slow down the opposition's temple by killing harvesters.

Some (not all) pvpers activly seek out harvesters in an attempt to slow down the temples being built (or so they say). This means that Some (not all) pvpers are activly seeking out things to do that are not fun.

The people in the old lands the other day (when I was ranting) will know I was swearing... a lot. It might not have been apropriate, espeically in the context that I was using it, but it defently sums up my personal feelings on this. And that is: despite saying you want a challenge with pvp, you clearly don't if you can accept this.

I do want pvp to be challenging and to mean something, but I can't see how killing people who are (effectivly) powerless (at the time) to do anything about it is in anyway a challenge.

The players who do think it's a challange to kill a harvester have yet to explain way.

I wonder if these two players could explain why this [killing an afk player] was a challenge (yes, it's a picture I took while I was writing this )
--
Please keep this discussion going, as it is something I hope the dev's think about when planning future events