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Re: Ryzom going Open PvP?
Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 6:51 am
by grimjim
I think most of us were really excited about outposts for the opportunity to build something, make our mark on the landscape and because of the bonuses they might give us.
Not for an excuse to tussle.
I hope the building choices are customisable, that different strengths and bonuses come from the different types of outposts and that they have a worth beyond being a PvP magnet.
Be nice if they played a role in the upcoming Karavan/Kami war too, enabling us to invade and hold land.
Re: Ryzom going Open PvP?
Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 7:46 am
by trenker
If fighting other players was like fighting mobs, only way more challenging and varied and entertaining, wouldn't we all love it? Wouldn't it be great to joke and tell stories afterwards of how so and so sneaked up behind you and got yer healers? Ho ho the fun we had!
Aren't you all just scarred of abuse and other people's ego's and maybe yer own?
PvP in Ryzom aint about elite status or points like most other games, it's about story and outposts. Lets stop worrying about some teenagers ego (no offence!) and give it a go like the mature folk we thinks we ares.
Final thought just came to me:
Chess scenario: "Awwww, Karparamov pawned by rook with his queen, the so and so, it aint fair, the elitist geek! I was just trying to check mate him which doesnt involve tacking pieces necessarily, awwww." My ego is so sore.....
Re: Ryzom going Open PvP?
Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 8:19 am
by aelvana
trenker wrote:If fighting other players was like fighting mobs, only way more challenging and varied and entertaining, wouldn't we all love it? Wouldn't it be great to joke and tell stories afterwards of how so and so sneaked up behind you and got yer healers? Ho ho the fun we had!
I know that from experience, I love it 8) I've tried to convince the community here. My old guild tried to create an atmosphere of excitement like that and was torn apart by the mother of all dramastorms. Even in the face of evidence that it rarely happens anyway (the roots), no one wanted to believe that they wouldn't be permacamped at teleporters and such. I'm going to quit now, before I frustrate myself again.
Re: Ryzom going Open PvP?
Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 11:28 am
by grimjim
"Chess scenario: "Awwww, Karparamov pawned by rook with his queen, the so and so, it aint fair, the elitist geek! I was just trying to check mate him which doesnt involve tacking pieces necessarily, awwww." My ego is so sore....."
Allow me to correct your scenario.
Imagine a chessboard, a big one, with a player and their pieces at each of the four sides.
All of them have a full set of pieces, you just have your king.
They're all white, you're all black.
Not only that, you're only allowed to move forwards. If you win a game you'll be allows to move forward and back.
If you win another game you'll be allowed to move sideways.
If you win another, diagonally.
Each game you win after than, you get extra pieces, starting with the pawns.
However, in order to get that extra maneoverability and scope you need to win games, with just your king, against three opponents.
Hardly likely to happen is it?
Now, they might have a great time 'pwning' you over and over again, bullying you, forcing you to sit down and play another round, time and time again, even though you really want to go over to the next table and play cards with your friends in a friendly way.
Hey, even when you manage to get up from the table and join your friends, they drag you back, even worse, they force your friends to play the same crippled game and laugh at your misfortune.
THAT is open PvP.
Re: Ryzom going Open PvP?
Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 2:45 pm
by wooden7
basicart wrote:Take a look around you in game this aint like WoW or GW we are all mature peeps here...
That isnt quite my point, I came here because of the mature peeps here and thats all great and dandy. Some great people here and in game but my WORRY is that it will slowly move away from that, I think outposts is a great idea and I can't wait to RP with them but I also worry that as soon as you stick a PvP label on something you suck in the l33t kiddies.
Great for sucking in more bucks, bad for my RP experience if you know what I mean.
I remember when SWG started, and how it's ended up now the l33t kiddies know that you can be a Jedi with nothing more than a grind (or a eBay buy).
**Not trying to pin labels on people here, I know plenty of kids that RP and plenty that don't care about elite PvPin', but you just have to take a look at WoW to know what a game can become when l33ters get let lose on it.
Re: Ryzom going Open PvP?
Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 4:35 pm
by glipe
dazman76 wrote:Not quite on thread topic, but several people have mentioned this quote and reacted in a positive way. I'm totally the opposite - I wonder why David even mentioned this figure. I haven't read through the letter fully, so I don't know whether this is David's vision for some far off future, or if he's actually commenting on stuff that is built/will be built in the near future.
Atys as we know it is pretty huge - well, huge compared to the player population anyway. We have 5 entire continents (the 5th is spread out, but piece it together and it's comparable I *think*), spanning a large virtual area. To think that this is only 5% of the real Atys just doesn't cut it - what's the other 95%, the same thing with trees in different places? The same mobs but different spawns? Creating new resources of any kind takes time, even if it's creating new mobs using the 'boss mob' technique (same mob, diff. textures, diff. AI values).
And once more of this remaining 95% is revealed, what happens to our current 5%? The playerbase could harldy 'populate' what we have at the moment, if you didn't close the original 5% when some more areas open, the playerbase would be even thinner that it is now. What good is a continent of 5 people?
I respect David for all he's achieved, but I feel this one comment blows that respect to pieces. It simply isn't believable, unless this remaining 95% is empty, boring and devoid of anything new at all.
Sorry to hijack a PvP thread, but since Ryzom will not go full-PvP without losing most of it's players, I don't feel too guilty.
I assume that the reason we don't have 100% of the world of Atys to us is for reasons close to what you voice with worry. Unless the areas were filled with useful content they would just spread the population of Atys thinly over the land. When there is content for it, it will be released. Added content brings increased player base. Larger player base begets larger content begets larger player base. I don't doubt that this has already been considered but lets think about it for a second.
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Ok, now that we've thought about it, let's talk about it! Think of the possibilities of the wider world and the amount of actual content that could be available from just an extra few percent of the world being opened to us. Karavan landing area? The Kami spawning pits? The origin of the goo? The camps of Elias? All these could be implemented with current technical resources and not "
empty, boring and devoid of anything new at all". A few lines of chatter for the NPCs, some interesting areas to explore, all new rites to try out and huge chunks of the plot to be uncovered. Heaven for eventing purposes, also.
I don't really understand why your respect for DCC has dropped. There is a lot of work to do but with a good vision and the will to succeed, the game will be fantastic.
Re: Ryzom going Open PvP?
Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 10:13 pm
by trenker
grimjim wrote:Allow me to correct your scenario.
Imagine a chessboard, a big one, with a player and their pieces at each of the four sides.........
Well that is not chess is it, doh. But I think you may be trying to say that my analogy is false because it implies a balanced and even playing field whereas you feel that open PvP will be vastly one sided. Specifically your analogy seems to indicate that everyone in open PvP will be against just your character.
This sounds a little paranoid or unfair or something like everyone picking on someone, such as bullying and such. Well if I take your meaning, then this is an extremely negative view.
Don't get me wrong, I can understand why someone would be worried in any PvP environment that everyone will gang up on them. I just don't think that would happen. It didn't even happen in school and I stick out from the crowd for various reasons.
Anyways, having just reread my post, I dont mean to imply anything personal; your opinion on open PvP turning into a crappy game is just as valid as any other opinion.