Ryzom

billg1 wrote:Stun also really only works if you get the link where as blind does not require the link, making blind the superior spell, where stun should actually be the better of the 2, allowing for always hitting and doing max damage.
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Not True. Stun works just like blind even if the link is not established. Like blind, on a succesful cast even without a link there is a period of 2-5 seconds were the mob is stunned. You can chain cast stun just like blind, the only difference is Stun is actually level dependent were blind is not.

tobaran wrote:Perhaps my understanding of what 'nerfed' means is different from others; to me, it means delete, cross-out, kaput, mangle and toss away, etc....

So, is this your meaning or something else, eh?

nerf - change for the worse.

whenever any power gets "fixed" by making it less effective, that's a nerf.

the term comes from "Nerf Guns." a series of children's toy guns that shot soft foam ammunition. it was impossible to seriously hurt someone with a shot from a "Nerf Gun."

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blind is too strong as it is. as a lvl 28 mage i could chain-cast blind and hold anything not immune. yesterday i was out with 2 other people, a 90 melee and a 50ish defensive caster.

we were spanking crabby gibbai, raging torbak, cuttlers, anything that looked at us funny...

when i can hold a mob that's 100+ lvls to me... something's wrong. i'd like it fixed the way the rest of you say. no immo, chance to attack, still low def and max dmg.

i also agree that using enchantments shouldn't give you xp. there should be some sort of incentive to get the magic starting package. as is you just buy an enchantment and sap crystals and boom! grats on becoming a full fledged mage. :/

euwest wrote:nerf - change for the worse.
i also agree that using enchantments shouldn't give you xp. there should be some sort of incentive to get the magic starting package. as is you just buy an enchantment and sap crystals and boom! grats on becoming a full fledged mage. :/

There is nothing wrong with that, probably 90% of the server did the same thing with fight. In fact, you have always been able to do this, just very few during beta realized it (or cared).

Starla wrote:Not True. Stun works just like blind even if the link is not established. Like blind, on a succesful cast even without a link there is a period of 2-5 seconds were the mob is stunned. You can chain cast stun just like blind, the only difference is Stun is actually level dependent were blind is not.

Same is true of fear.

Perhaps a better approach to dealing with Blind would be rather than nerfing it into oblivion (the most likely approach) instead raise the prices on the skill to the point where you have to be a blind specialist.

Make the level limits a hard cap, level one works on mobs lvl 15 or less, level two goes up to lvl 30 (exact progression i'm not 100% certain on, plenty of room for tweaking) then drive the skill point costs thru the roof, i'm thinking a base of 100 skill points minimum, 200 wouldn't be out of hand. Upgrades stay expensive, 100 skill points for an upgrade every ten levels wouldn't be unreasonable.

Essentially, if you want to be a blinder that ability is available to you, but that will be your class defining skill. Somewhat like the Shaman class in EverQuest that way, they're the best slowers in the game (slow attack speed spells are essential in EQ) but aside from a line of stat buffs, do very little else.

By raising the cost involved, Nevrax could keep blind in it's current form intact, the price you pay for being a blinder is an inability to function as a healer or nuker. Seems reasonable to me.

You don't need to increase the spell points if the spells work within their intended range. A level 1 blind spell would work up to a level 15 creature. Higher than 15 it should become a lot less effective and by level 25 creatures it does nothing.

Right now people don't need to upgrade their spells. Level 1 works just as good as level 20. Actually better, because it costs less sap etc.

As far as the stun effect of blind, I agree that mobs should attack when blinded. Blind should make a creature much easier to hit, and reduce its offense, but other spells should get to shine too.

bgrifter wrote:Perhaps a better approach to dealing with Blind would be rather than nerfing it into oblivion (the most likely approach) instead raise the prices on the skill to the point where you have to be a blind specialist.

Make the level limits a hard cap, level one works on mobs lvl 15 or less, level two goes up to lvl 30 (exact progression i'm not 100% certain on, plenty of room for tweaking) then drive the skill point costs thru the roof, i'm thinking a base of 100 skill points minimum, 200 wouldn't be out of hand. Upgrades stay expensive, 100 skill points for an upgrade every ten levels wouldn't be unreasonable.

Essentially, if you want to be a blinder that ability is available to you, but that will be your class defining skill. Somewhat like the Shaman class in EverQuest that way, they're the best slowers in the game (slow attack speed spells are essential in EQ) but aside from a line of stat buffs, do very little else.

By raising the cost involved, Nevrax could keep blind in it's current form intact, the price you pay for being a blinder is an inability to function as a healer or nuker. Seems reasonable to me.

Wouldn't change anything. With the current blind-mania most groups will have (or have already) a lvl 100 blinder by the time they finally fix this and high SP are not really an issue.

There are times when the player community itself has to recognize when a situation is too intrinsicaly imbalanced, and ask/demand for modifications that will de-power us in the short-term, but empower us in the long-run, by finding use for all sorts of abilities to be employed in different circumstances, to allow us to proceed with some degree of strategy (God forbid!).

So thanks to those who recognize the complete absurdity of 'BLIND' and are willing to investigate the game with new intricacies.

I generally agree with the majority of suggestions about it's nerfing. There are two ways to go about it, possibly different AI for different creatures -

1) Creature, while blind, instinctively covers it's vital parts, so that, while it is not dodging per se, it takes reduced damage.

2) Creature, while blind, lashes out indiscriminately at anything in range, causing normal damage.

In either case, there is no sensible argument for immobility. It would run willy-nilly, trying to avoid the pain. In motion pathing, it would be noticeably different from fear, as the creature will always, when feared, retreat as fast as possible from the party origin point, not through it.

Although I am not a caster, I DO wish that there was some meaningful use for spells like Sleep or Root. As it stands currently, I am very uncertain as to what benefits would be attained by using either of these in lieu of Stun or Blind. This is a pity, but I, alas don't have much in the way of suggestion, although it seems to me that Sleep should NOT be a link spell (or rather be SOLELY a link spell), so that it can be used as a 'pacify'-type mechanism allowing mobillity.

ALL spells that are cast upon a creature, but fail, should incur aggro. I don't understand why that's not the case now. I can't swing at a monster, miss, and say, "Oh goodness, that was a mistake, my apologies." It shouldn't be otherwise with casters.

Looking forward to the progression of the game,

Ragram

shrike wrote:Wouldn't change anything. With the current blind-mania most groups will have (or have already) a lvl 100 blinder by the time they finally fix this and high SP are not really an issue.

Simple fix to that is to refund points and change the skill. Point refunds have already been hinted at for other skills, wouldn't be a problem doing the same for Blind. Would certainly make life difficult for those milking the skill they know full well is too good right now, but I don't think anyone honestly expects Blind to stay as it is for long. It's too good and everyone knows it. Can't cry foul too harshly when that changes.

kisedd wrote:You don't need to increase the spell points if the spells work within their intended range. A level 1 blind spell would work up to a level 15 creature. Higher than 15 it should become a lot less effective and by level 25 creatures it does nothing.

Right now people don't need to upgrade their spells. Level 1 works just as good as level 20. Actually better, because it costs less sap etc.

As far as the stun effect of blind, I agree that mobs should attack when blinded. Blind should make a creature much easier to hit, and reduce its offense, but other spells should get to shine too.

Exactly so. Mobs should be able to atack at lowered efficiency while Blinded. I pose a different question though: is it the spell itself that is at fault or the mobs' individual magic resistance? Blind1 should have no effect on anything but the most common 'light green' lowbie mobs.

My own experience with Blind has been that I have much more trouble Blinding creatures in the light blue/dark blue ranges as I get resisted a lot more even when using Blind5 at 58 off afflict. I admit I haven't been using it on creatures 50-100 levels higher than myself, but then again I and my usual hunting cohorts generally fight the creatures that we consider ourselves reasonably likely to be able to kill and still get a full 3k xp. Perhaps the higher level yellow/orange creatures' magic resistance itself is the problem?