Ryzom

If the problem is that new players think that they can't live without cats, then I see 2 solution:

1- Put a level cap on CATS: ie you can use cats only with skills higher than 100

2- Guild leader..wake up !! Ask yourself who is the one that is giving away tons of free cats to noob ? Why ? Who told them that they can waste cats on anything ?
I didn't even knew of cats until I found a kami temple with a vendor who sell cats (you need honor points to buy).
So I've asked around to learn what is a cats and what are honor points and only at that time I learn about cats.
I reached level 50 or more in everything before I knew about cats, just because I refused to join a guild too early;
So my guess is that is not cats that are bad, but is GL and HO that are giving away cats too easily, maybe just to acquire a new guild member as soon as they land on main land.

Dont' want cats to spread the world? State it clearly that your guild won't give cats to low level players or say that you will give 1 cats a month or something like this.
Don't blame cats, blame yourself.

The woman that lives next door has four cats and as much as I like the little furry creatures four is too many. I would be willing to lose them even if they had cute level caps on.

As someone who distributes q50 cats to any that need them, a level cap of 100 would stop many people getting q50 cats for free and reduce the number of OP's by four. This would only make the situation worse I believe.

P.S. This is not an advert for q50 cats and no cats were harmed during this post.

I don't really understand taking out cats.
1. They are optional you don't have to use. If you're not getting any and want them, it's easy enough to trade mats, weapons, armor, and even get freebies from those whom have them. Take a second to get out of your "the people who have these cats are greedy, evil, selfish, and would never need to give me any" and meet and talk to them, I'm sure many a OP owner guilds members would give cats to anyone wanting some, yes there will be limitations, but thats even true of those with OP's. You can level with no cats, as a matter of fact got from 180-215 2 hand axe with no cats in one day .
2. This will kill most of the pvp'ers desire to compete, and really sense pvp'ers make up a large percentage of the population here, would be dumb to do . why try to dwindle down our population by removing something so many like, due to the opinions or a small few,compared to total server population?
3. Whats wrong with leveling faster? Even those whom are super dedicated to grind would spend 6 or more years or more to master everything. Why not allow them items to lessen that time? What does it hurt? Sure maybe they have more masters then you. Does that make them a better player then you? NO, in game experience, learning things like how to tank, how to cast without draining all your stats in 3 casts, finding good recipes in crafting, or finding a way to dig and pull 3 more mats then you used to makes you a good player. To be honest I've seen tanks with 6 melee masters whom couldn't compete with tanking skills of someone with only 1 master. I've also seen crafter with a few craft masters whom just barely beat npc items for stats . If these types of people level faster, but still suck at what they are doing, where as you don't use cats and learn more, who's really the better player?
4. Why complain about the item/op? It's not the item causing the issues, it's the people. Yeah the people. Those whom get jealous for not having cats, or do things like take OP battles to seriously. Those whom wont party with the other group b/c they fought them at an op. Or they have cats and we don't. Its just a game calm the he.. down. Doesn't matter what faction you are, or whom you've lost or won against in an OP battle. Grind is grind. Learn to separate the two and you will be a much happier player and have fun playing with people of all factions and in game beliefs. Personally I see no difference between karavan and kami when it comes to leveling. I'm just as happy to stay on for 4 extra hours to help a nice kami get a level 250, even if he was nuking me at the OP, then a kara friend. It doesn't matter what you do at an OP. It doesn't make you a bad player. fighting and killing one another is what OPs are for. If you can't understand this I recommend you stay away from OPs.
5. Everyone is not equal. Everyone will never be equal. Should everyone be equal what would be the point to play? Taking out cats to try to make everyone the same is stupid. Those whom work harder or form stronger groups will get and earn the better supply of items, weapons, mats, whatever. Thats life! No reason to try to turn this into a Carebare version of the real world. I mean what comes after cats? Everyone has to equally share grind time? Dig mats? Only allowed to talk to CSRs for two minutes so everyone else has equal time? When one person gets dp, everyone else must die? Everyone can only play for 1 hour a day b/c one of the players is only allowed 1 hour a day? yeah seems a bit outrageous, but really that's what those wanting things like ops and cats out of game are implying.... Equality. That will never happen. It should never happen. Have you all thought about that?

This post is directed at those complaining in uni and parties about cats being the root of all evil on the server. It's not the cats but how people react to pvp, not having something someone else has and how people think differently about then them. We will never be equal. Learn to deal with that and take what you have with pride. Sure being in a kara guild I'm a bit better off then some. But we are limited. Where as there are other kara guilds whom have constant access to 250Q cats. Is it fair? No, but I really don't care, I have awesome guildies, we hunt all the time, with or without cats, I still have one heck of a good time. I have tons of kami friends also. I'd never tell them about our personal faction plans, or secrets, that doesn't make them any less fun to kill mobs with.

by the way I rarely read or post on forums, making flames at me would be a waste of time, I doubt I'll check this thread again . I just wanted to make my standpoint known.

Needs a third option:

3. Cats only work for crafting.

nazak07 wrote:1. They are optional you don't have to use. If you're not getting any and want them, it's easy enough to trade mats, weapons, armor, and even get freebies from those whom have them.....

A person's PoV is undeniable affected by "where they are sitting". As a member of a guild with not one but 2 OP's, you must understand that a person with no OP is going to have a different outlook than you.

And "easy enough" ? New toon joins game, finds the lore suits him better from the kami perspective and works his way up to 200. Explain how this person will find it "easy enough" to get 250 cats as a kami (with 1 outta 8 250 OP's) as he would have if he chose other faction. And yes there are several players I know of whom peeps can get 250 cats from occassionally, as long as they "don't tell anyone" cause they don't wanna be harrassed by members of their faction.

Let's say a peep is neutral and OP less. How many grind mats you want for a stack of 250's ? How many hours does he have to invest in a grindish, unappealing activity comapred to you for the same reward ?

2. This will kill most of the pvp'ers desire to compete, and really sense pvp'ers make up a large percentage of the population here, would be dumb to do . why try to dwindle down our population by removing something so many like, due to the opinions or a small few,compared to total server population?

Let's remember half the population left when OP's were introduced. Many more (of both factions) are on the verge of doing so. And many, many PvP'ers are saying the same thing about cats. Especially those who have had the experience of earning them before and after cats introduction. I'll restate "This will kill most of the pvp'ers desire to compete [unless they keep their advanatge]...."

Ya wanna compete ? Ya want a challenge ? Then next time ya show up at an OP battle that isn't your OP, count the number of players and pick the side with the numbers disadvantage.

50% of Blizzards servers are non PvP. That tells me the PvP market holds no numbers advantage over the PvE market.

3. Whats wrong with leveling faster?

As many people have already observed, peeps who level too fast are not staying. The "turnover" in game is much higher since cats....no doubt about it. I see hoards of 250 mages and tanks with dig / craft skills that are no where. Guilds are supplying them with all their stuff, powerleveling them up to serve as warriors in OP battles. If they skipped some of the power leveling, they'd get a chance to stop and smell the flowers so to speak and maybe discover more of Atys that would hold their interest.

4. Why complain about the item/op? It's not the item causing the issues, it's the people. Yeah the people. Those whom get jealous for not having cats, or do things like take OP battles to seriously....

Don't ya think that sounds like the infamous "Let them eat cake" argument. Damn peasants.

A year or so ago, i would have agreed to have the cats taken away, but imo, now it is too late. Too many people use them on a daily basis. I suggest taking a look at this poll for better options

nazak07 wrote:I don't really understand taking out cats.
1. They are optional you don't have to use. If you're not getting any and want them, it's easy enough to trade mats, weapons, armor, and even get freebies from those whom have them. Take a second to get out of your "the people who have these cats are greedy, evil, selfish, and would never need to give me any" and meet and talk to them, I'm sure many a OP owner guilds members would give cats to anyone wanting some, yes there will be limitations, but thats even true of those with OP's. You can level with no cats, as a matter of fact got from 180-215 2 hand axe with no cats in one day .

I see far too many people, certainly amoung the newer player who do not see them as optional.

nazak07 wrote: 2. This will kill most of the pvp'ers desire to compete, and really sense pvp'ers make up a large percentage of the population here, would be dumb to do . why try to dwindle down our population by removing something so many like, due to the opinions or a small few,compared to total server population?

That's purely an opinion, where do you get the numbers for the fact PvPers make up a large percentage of the population. However on what you said, before EP2 I had a large number of old hands on my friend list who were first and formost PvEers, when I came back a year after EP2 and OPs that portion of my friend list was a waste land. The argument works either way.

nazak07 wrote: 3. Whats wrong with leveling faster? Even those whom are super dedicated to grind would spend 6 or more years or more to master everything. Why not allow them items to lessen that time? What does it hurt? Sure maybe they have more masters then you. Does that make them a better player then you? NO, in game experience, learning things like how to tank, how to cast without draining all your stats in 3 casts, finding good recipes in crafting, or finding a way to dig and pull 3 more mats then you used to makes you a good player. To be honest I've seen tanks with 6 melee masters whom couldn't compete with tanking skills of someone with only 1 master. I've also seen crafter with a few craft masters whom just barely beat npc items for stats . If these types of people level faster, but still suck at what they are doing, where as you don't use cats and learn more, who's really the better player?

The tree was never designed in a way that expected any player to gain a master at everything. I like to chew my food before I swallow it.

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Taidi

First came the Saga of Ryzom open game where everyone was to work against a common enemy....
Then came The faction wars which saw many leave Ryzom....
PvP was integrated and grudgingly accepted as part of Ryzom....
Cats were introduced to allow fast levelling...there is no other reason for cats.
Fast levelling is always needed for PvP based games...ergo...
Ryzom is a PvP game,
Now all we need to do is stop the darn Rp mob getting in the way.....

Darn it....Have I been 'Bait and Switch' manipulated again !!!

To those who doubt I Quote a famous phrase from another game...

"Jedi will never be a starting profession"

Aye we do have two Ops, but we also have like 50 active members, anyone whom ever owned and op knows that, 2 ops are far to few to provide a large supply to all members daily. Unlike the guilds that have 4 members and an OP. I totally don't approve of that lol. Really I'm saying quit gripping, no reason to take out cats. Shouldn't allow them to get to you. If you let an item effect hoe you feel, get the heck out of the game and get a real life lol. general statement, not directed at anyone.

Okay after reading the posts here it seems to me that you are not considering the actual status of MMORPG population, and you forgot what's happened since 2004:

1. Most if not all of the new games released emphasizes more in fast leveling and long term end-game. WoW was released and, unfortunately, changed most of the Companies strategies around MMOs.

2. Ryzom is wonderful but need a lot of commitment to play it. Don't say it suits the casual playing because this is true only when: you have done most of the game, you have good relations with the players, you are part of the community. Reality is that Ryzom is not for casual playing actually. Yes, you are not forced to do anything, i am the first that spend hours just to travel wuthout getting a single xp, but... hey we have zillions of skills, why not do as much as possibile and show the uberness?

So, reality is that Ryzom is a 'hard' game, not for everyone, and it was much harder in the past. People want to socialize, yes, but they want levels too, they want stuff too.

So, consider a people (a new people) just looking at skill tree and wondering how many masteries there are in game. It's easy to go frustrated, unless you really get the feeling of the world and the environment.

Someone have calculated that a player could level up to 250 ele in 80 hours. It's not true of course, because you have to consider the time needed to find a new spot after leveled and such. Anyway, in the past the developers said that, playing full time with full knowledge of the best things to do, a player could master everything in 6 months!

Reality is that till now, after 3 years, not counting people in beta, no one reached all masteries, and very few got 'a lot' of them.

3. Most of the new players come from easy games. Most of them (not everyone, we sure have some good exception) will want cats, if there are in game. They are in game so I use cats. Simple.

Ryzom is hard, using cats just help people to feel they are doing something not just after 4 hours of heavy hunt.

The point about people will rush to level and will not know anything about the game can be true, but just for people that normally don't play Ryzom as they need other audience to feel good.
A normal player that want actually play the game, just can use cats and *not* use spoilers, go searching the knowledge of Atys, go reading the Lore, etc...

I don't think removing cats will incentivate people to explore more the planet, go mapping all the tribes, move the mecktoubs instead of just freeing them in one land and rebuying in another land. I freed only once my mecks just to buy the 'rapid' ones the day after they were patched ingame. Other than that I always trekked my animals and never lost one.

If you fill new players with everything, spoil everything then they will not play the game and cats have nothing to do with this.

All this bunch of useless words to say that cats are useful to feel Ryzom a bit less hard for new players not used to play hard games. And, actually, they are still optional.