Ryzom

dakhound wrote:My opinion is ... Risk=reward .............so simple

Exactly my point. The creatures in the prime roots just have twice as much health as their aboveground counterparts. For the rest they're identical, they don't do more damage, they don't have special abilities or anything. The double health doesn't make them anymore dangerous, it just makes the battles last longer. It's maybe twice as much effort, but not twice as much risk. You can still go by the pull-kill routine.
Just like with the stronger herbies. (I could bring the same RP argument against that change too by the way, legged fluffballs aren't supposed to be kicking elite kitin soldiers all over Nexus. ) But my main problem with the superherbies is that their health was increased by six, and apart from that they weren't made anymore powerfull (I think they may do some more damage than before, but not substanstial). Killing them hasn't become more riskier, it just takes six times longer. The one time I've hunted madakams right after the patch was one of the most boring hunts I've ever been in.

I don't want the roots to be pointless, but I don't want them to turn into a grinding ground. Now if the prime roots creatures really were a lot more dangerous to hunt, more intelligent, larger aggro ranges, increased social behavior, almost impossible to pull one at a time, then I would be all for a substantial experience reward for hunting them.
In fact I would consider that extremely welcome, it would give us the choice of hunting in dangerous terrain for more experience per mob but also with more deaths. No longer the fastest way to gain experience being constant pulling and killing of the same mob in the safest possible location, but contantly fighting three mobs at once while dodging patrols and getting a party wipe every ten minutes. I know what I'd choose

sidusar wrote:Exactly my point. The creatures in the prime roots just have twice as much health as their aboveground counterparts. For the rest they're identical, they don't do more damage, they don't have special abilities or anything. The double health doesn't make them anymore dangerous, it just makes the battles last longer.

and how does making a fight last twice as long NOT increase the risk ?
maybe not for a full size party with multiple healers, nukers and tanks.. but solo ?

I am becoming a little bitter and twisted ATM, due to not being able to find parties to hunt with ( in the skills I want to develop ) so having to solo. Too much time in my own company

But if the mobs require more effort/input to deal with, any one can see they should provide more reward/output.

i want a Yubokoo + 3k xp anywhere in Wastelands ty

sidusar wrote:Exactly my point. The creatures in the prime roots just have twice as much health as their aboveground counterparts. For the rest they're identical, they don't do more damage, they don't have special abilities or anything. The double health doesn't make them anymore dangerous, it just makes the battles last longer. It's maybe twice as much effort, but not twice as much risk.

shhh stop bringing up almost valid points or I'll come gank you (j/k)

your right in a way I suppose about the fact they dont do any more damage and you could go for the pull/kill routine non stop and do it in relative safety. For 1 the Xp is still slower so theres no point this again leads people to decide why bother hunting in PR when I can kill a jug in 5 hits and get 3k with no risk of a kitin patrol seeing me from 50mtrs away and wiping me

see it this way though, as it is now

go to GoC, position yourself 25-30 mtrs from jug, start casting. it takes 2 spells for a jug to really notice you, 2 spells for it to reach you and it might just get a hit at the end of which doesnt matter as you have a healer *right* - easy 3k

do the same again in PR and the jug will not only reach you but hit you another 3-4 times while your wearing light armour and theres a chance that will lead to your death especially if you get a few resists. add the posibility of just 1 add and your well and truly screwed. I really think more xp is deserved for the PR jug.

there is more risk, therefore there should be more reward

otherwise I say again we have 11 (guessing) zones of atys which have no use but for sneaky diggers and the odd trip.

(and yubkoo would be ace IMO)

iwojimmy wrote:and how does making a fight last twice as long NOT increase the risk ?
maybe not for a full size party with multiple healers, nukers and tanks.. but solo ?

dakhound wrote:do the same again in PR and the jug will not only reach you but hit you another 3-4 times while your wearing light armour and theres a chance that will lead to your death especially if you get a few resists. add the posibility of just 1 add and your well and truly screwed. I really think more xp is deserved for the PR jug.

That's true, twice as much health does mean more risk for the soloer or for the elemental/healer combo. But we're not talking about those here. They're not the ones who need to hunt ubermobs. If you're crazy enough to solo at those levels, great jugulas still give 2000 exp at level 245. And a team of two can hunt great kinchers for the same exp.
It's large teams of people who need stronger creatures to hunt because the normal creatures don't give them enough experience. And for a large team multiplying creature health by two doesn't add much risk.

I wouldn't mind if they multiplied PR mobs exp by two as a temporary solution, just like they did with the superherbies. (At least I hope that's meant as a temporary solution. A nettled bolobi beating off two awesome kirostas at once? Come on...) But I'd really like a way of hunting which truly gives a greater experience reward in exchange for a greater risk. I believe someone suggested a while ago that they implement creatures that come in packs, and fighting one pulls the whole pack on you, no way to pull just one out. Kind of like how kirosta patrols work, but on a smaller level. Something like that I'd really like to see. In my experience fighting more creatures at once is the only thing that's really risky for a full team. Fighting just one creature isn't risky no matter how much health it has, unless it also kills every partymember in one hit and then it's just impossible.

dakhound wrote:otherwise I say again we have 11 (guessing) zones of atys which have no use but for sneaky diggers and the odd trip.

Nine; Umbra has 4 regions, Wastelands 3, Abyss and Underspring are both one region. Though only Wastelands and Underspring are purple zones.

sidusar wrote:.....
I believe someone suggested a while ago that they implement creatures that come in packs, and fighting one pulls the whole pack on you, no way to pull just one out. Kind of like how kirosta patrols work, but on a smaller level. Something like that I'd really like to see. In my experience fighting more creatures at once is the only thing that's really risky for a full team. Fighting just one creature isn't risky no matter how much health it has, unless it also kills every partymember in one hit and then it's just impossible.

......

and the answer given before was .. bandit camps

unfortunately you get xp for the individual bandits, with no allowance for the number attacking or the abilities they use ( hint.. dont try to melee solo a bandit carrying a dagger )

sidusar wrote: I believe someone suggested a while ago that they implement creatures that come in packs, and fighting one pulls the whole pack on you, no way to pull just one out.

http://ryzom.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16080



Yes, bandits exhibit this behavior and give no appropriate XP reward for it. That's for fame....

It would be a bit ridiculous for homins to hunt homins for XP for hours on end, so to enact this for the high level team problem it would need to be implemented on creatures. But the AI is obviously there.

Now if these social groups were implemented only in the Prime Roots - even better!

sehracii wrote:http://ryzom.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16080



Yes, bandits exhibit this behavior and give no appropriate XP reward for it. That's for fame....

It would be a bit ridiculous for homins to hunt homins for XP for hours on end, so to enact this for the high level team problem it would need to be implemented on creatures. But the AI is obviously there.

Now if these social groups were implemented only in the Prime Roots - even better!

tried hunting on a varinx spawn once, thats certainly *exciting* in max DP kind of way

sehracii wrote:http://ryzom.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16080



Yes, bandits exhibit this behavior and give no appropriate XP reward for it. That's for fame....

It would be a bit ridiculous for homins to hunt homins for XP for hours on end, so to enact this for the high level team problem it would need to be implemented on creatures. But the AI is obviously there.

Now if these social groups were implemented only in the Prime Roots - even better!

Okay, figures that was you. Everytime I want to suggest something you've already beaten me to it.

Though groups of 10 seems a bit much, I was thinking more along groups of 4. Usually if I was in a full team hunting creatures that gave good exp, 2 adds we could handle, 3 meant a wipe. To take on a group of ten the creatures would have to be lower level than the players, and you'd need a pretty high experience bonus to still get decent experience off something lower level in a full group.

Not sure what the exp bonus should be, that would require some delicate testing. But I do think it's a better solution than superherbies.

Yeah, 10 is defintely much - not sure what I was thinking


But 4-5 would be great.

And as for as how much reward - they could just shoot low first, and bump it up if people find them not worth the time.