Ryzom

you know ummax, i think a lot of ppl got bored of you trolling these threads and stopped posting - it's not pretty.

I'm not sure exactly why you have such an issue with ryzom.org, tbh i dont really care. I do wish you would stop speaking for 'everyone' and 'the majority' and 'the bulk of the players' and any other group you feel you are representing. because you arent.

have a nice day.

Anyhow if you want to know why I dont agree with the ryzom project its because you insist I dont understand when I do and because of the way the people in "the community" who are suddenly poping up have presented themselves to the community.

I dont like the way you are presenting yourself to those who might be new subscribers its not a good face to present and you say you reflect the community which you dont. If I had seen this kind of attitude when I Logged into the game I would never have fronted my money.

Now if you can't see that as I have said it like 2 million times then I"m sorry if you dont understand how I see marketing and persona and presentability to be a super important part of making an advance in the business world. If you were to knock at my door and say hey I"m saving ryzom and then spit in my face and demand money do you think that its a good thing?

Of course not.

Anyhow I rest my case. I dont really care who was here first if that is the kind of attitude you have then I want nothing to do with you because "being here first" does not grant one the right to say and do what you want. It does not grant the right to talk down to people like you have to me (the only "new person" who has dared to disagree with you)

Respect is earned and since I dont know you any better then you know me is it possible that they way you have presented yourself to me has coloured my views on the project? just a bit?

Is it possible that even though you say I am free to come to the forum an post my concerns that I may not feel free to based on the way you have dealt with things on this forum? Just a bit

Here is the bottom line. Im an inteligent person with a point of view. I know how the world goes round and I know how problems can be solved and how they can be avoided. I know how I like to see people treated. I know how I have seen some people treat others (not just me) with regard to their point of view on this project and as I have said if your purpose is to try to lobby this community I prefer to be lobbied by a more presentable person. NOw the three or four first people I had a chance to talk to and with on this forum have been nothing but rude and condescending and talk down to me because they think i don't understand. Hmm I understand perfectly I have also treid to point out that I thought you would market stuff much better however if the average surfer saw a more presentable site, a server that worked better (at the time it was mostly inaccessible) and when they posted a question on a forum any forum would not be talked down to. Now having read up on who called everyone trolls who was a moderator at one point in time on these very forums and who self destructed and then became a "former nevrax" employee I can only hazard some guesses of who the person is presently using that word repeatedly on this forum and others. just a guess

however having researched the people named i found information as well

one very interesting piece of information was with regard do xavier and his past indescretions

he self destructed on this very forum and started acting like hitler basically and two moderators who still exist had to come in and calm the forum down and do damage control. They then took the moderating keys away from him the rest remains to be found out on your own, but findable it is.

So I assemble that with the stolen email addresses, the unproffessional websites and the guy that just popped up for no reason in particular really since he has been gone to defiantly reassure me of his presence I get a very bad picture. So if your goal was to not have me or people like me play your game you have succeeded (assuming you will have a game for people to play)

And that is why I would never donate a dime to it and if and when ryzom.org gets hold of this I will be playing another game. I dont want to be lorded over, banned from forums from having an opinion or being told how it is. So far that is the past history from what I could dig up and coupled with the present history (and I was unaware of what happened in the past until a week ago when I accidently tripped over it) it spells stay away in big capital letters.

Now if i find this out just by accident and formed this opinion just by reading posts (remember I didnt say anything at first I just sat and read the info for awhile) I only posted after I read the stuff and said hey guys your being a little pushy etc and then i got pushed around too... what do you think that I think the game will be like?

I'm also an "average player" as in i play games to have fun and have no interest in the business end.

again I'm sorry that you cant see this but this is how you present to a lot of people and I hope you dont have to find out just how many and that another buyer picks it up so I can continue to play a game that will be good to its customers

so you can be as busy as you want but only about 25% if less of the posters on this particular board are looking positively at the ryzom project. That means possibly that you may only inherit 50% of the present player base. In other words they wont like what they see when you take over and take a hike real fast. That is an opinion formed based on how ryzom.org presented itself to people on this forum in the first two weeks of existance. Also remember people form opinions in the first 30 seconds of encountering the situation.

I'm generally pretty good as scoping this stuff out as well.

/shrug

rushin wrote:you know ummax, i think a lot of ppl got bored of you trolling these threads and stopped posting - it's not pretty.

I'm not sure exactly why you have such an issue with ryzom.org, tbh i dont really care. I do wish you would stop speaking for 'everyone' and 'the majority' and 'the bulk of the players' and any other group you feel you are representing. because you arent.

have a nice day.

cause i'm interested in marketing they keep coming back and so they must have an interest as well its what I do on the net I market stuff so obviously im' interested

got a better idea what to do on these forums?

lets see i ask my ingame questions ingames, i play with a guild ingame

I answer the 2 or 3 newbie questions that come up and there are not a lot of other active threads? what should I be doing on these forums? lol

and ryzom.org is speaking for you or me then? lol i guess that proved a point as well anyhow I have seen a lot more peopel disagree with them then agree so i counted so the bulk of players on this forum aren't happy with ryzom.org

and yes I dont like them because i think they are nasty people in general based on their horrible way of presenting themselves to us and then there is the #105 majority of the poll.. which helps as well hehe

ummax wrote:I answer the 2 or 3 newbie questions that come up and there are not a lot of other active threads? what should I be doing on these forums? lol

Anything OTHER than feeding the trolls man...

I will be one of the first to leave if Xavier and his flunkies take over... until then they are little more than a blip on the radar unless you help them keep on top of the forums.

Please give it a rest...

vguerin wrote:.

Please give it a rest...

err why these threads are left open for people to talk I dont drag it into other threads why should i give it a rest ? now I have a problem just dont open this thread if you dont want to read it that is what I do when I dont want to hear about ryzom.org (i stay away from the free ryzom and xavier) thread meanwhile when I feel like talking about it I will (and honestly i haven't posted to these 2 threads for 2 weeks so what is the problem now? )

ummax wrote:he self destructed on this very forum and started acting like hitler basically and two moderators who still exist had to come in and calm the forum down and do damage control. They then took the moderating keys away from him the rest remains to be found out on your own, but findable it is.

That makes totally no sense at all, your sources seem to be very unreliable.

dont open this thread if you dont want to read it that is what I do when I dont want to hear about ryzom.org

wellthenwhyareyoustillhereandmakingmorepoststhaneveryoneelse?


Why oh why must you always bring this thread down to war...

ummax wrote:and yes I dont like them because i think they are nasty people in general based on their horrible way of presenting themselves to us and then there is the #105 majority of the poll.. which helps as well hehe

That's because the question in this poll here is not about who is against the idea, but about who doesn't think it's the BEST option. That does not necessarily mean that those 105 are against it. I hope you can understand that you should actually understand the answers of the poll to get a representative result, this poll won't give any.

kaetemi wrote:That's because the question in this poll here is not about who is against the idea, but about who doesn't think it's the BEST option. That does not necessarily mean that those 105 are against it. I hope you can understand that you should actually understand the answers of the poll to get a representative result, this poll won't give any.

My 2 pence:

The non-profit idea is IMHO a last ditch approach. Better than nothing, but a company that intends to develop and continue the game in at least a similar manner to Nevrax is by far prefered.

And I also have issues with Xaviers approach to forum moderation, so do worry about what damage a further position of power could do...

ummax wrote: Anyhow I'm tired of this issue anyhow I pointed out that someone went and was accused of trolling when they asked about someones background you called him a troll OPENLY and never actualy answered the question nor to this day are dealing with any issue which is uncomfortable to you which is fine, but many are leary and distrusting of how things go as a result of it anyhow this also has been said over and over and over and over ad nauseum if you dont want to read the threads its fine, but i'm not rehashing what has been said repeatedly in 20 different ways for several weeks.

I haven't called anyone a troll. I'm not Ryzom.org. I'm a new player of Ryzom, this game that we all hopefully enjoy. Maybe you're right, and there have been unhelpful or aggressive proponents of both views, but can't we just accept there are always going to be some people who can't discuss things reasonably?

I can only speak from my experience, if Ryzom.org was worse and has become the mature and sensible community it is now, good for them. Since the initial trolls responded to my post, I see there are actually a good many other players here who are intelligent, mature and welcoming, on both sides of this debate, so I'm very relieved that this forum isn't as hostile to newbies as I first thought.

ummax wrote: again go for it your defending nothing I asked him to stay I found him to be a personable person and a good representative of ryzom.org and have said as much and your reaction is as usual to defend something the opposite of what I have siad (so yea we are a realy unwelcoming bunch a member of the "non ryzom.org" community says to a guy working on the project "hey I like you , your polite and reasonable please stay" and what is happening to my post? people are making an argument of it YET AGAIN)

I wasn't defending anyone. I haven't a clue what Xavier is really like, nor his history with the company, and I won't presume to say he is a paragon of virtue when I just don't know. As far as I can tell though, few others do either... most is pure speculation and innuendo, as I said. If there is a solid reason Xavier should not be trusted, I've yet to find it. Until I do, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. I also don't see how I can have a 'usual' reaction, when I've posted exactly twice.

GO FOR IT your again proving the us and them thing and the aggressive thing after I paid a person a compliment

Why would I go to a board with a group of people who when I compliment them defend something that is opposite and take only the bad out of the post and throw away the good?

You're quite right, respect should be a two way street. For now though, couldn't you be the better person? Insulting me really won't hurt the community effort, I'm not part of it yet.


Do you guys realize that successful or not, the Ryzom.org thing is really great for publicizing Ryzom? Even if you disagree with joining this particular 'save the game' bandwagon, surely the free advertising and increased publicity in places that dollars usually can't reach effectively can only be a good thing? If they are outfinanced, at least that benefit remains for a little while. It sure worked in my case, and I'm so glad it did!

avaeran wrote:I haven't called anyone a troll. (...) Since the initial trolls responded to my post,

I just think it was funny

Only a question... how do you know Ryzom? If you know it by a Free Soft world website, you migth be a little biased towards the Free Soft idea, more than the best for Ryzom. No blame for you, as long you haven't played more than a few days is normal; in the other side, is normal that people who have play for months or years don't see the project in the same eyes.

I always have thinked that the Free Software people are very "out of the word". They feel they are morality superiors, think they defend the most democratic and the better idea. Even they think that everyone see the things like that (and that everyone hates MS, btw). Then they come to places like this, with people with other preferences and with other values, and they surprise because the people don't react as they wish.

I think that Ryzom.org have the delusion, on a start, that they'll have the community in his hands (Hey, boys! It's free software, it's democratic and cool) and his approach was horrible. And, when the damage was done, the response was "You are a awfull and trollish community! I can't understand!".

This is not Slashdot. Here you have to gain the people, and you haven't done it. At first you've come like you are the saviours of the hominkind, and as second, you response to our critics as we are childs and trolls.

This is a mature community, as we have demonstrated for months or years. If you get this response, think what have you done bad, and don't blame us as trolls.

mithur wrote:I just think it was funny

Good point, missed that. My mistake.

mithur wrote: Only a question... how do you know Ryzom? If you know it by a Free Soft world website, you migth be a little biased towards the Free Soft idea, more than the best for Ryzom. No blame for you, as long you haven't played more than a few days is normal; in the other side, is normal that people who have play for months or years don't see the project in the same eyes.

I always have thinked that the Free Software people are very "out of the word". They feel they are morality superiors, think they defend the most democratic and the better idea. Even they think that everyone see the things like that (and that everyone hates MS, btw). Then they come to places like this, with people with other preferences and with other values, and they surprise because the people don't react as they wish.

I think that Ryzom.org have the delusion, on a start, that they'll have the community in his hands (Hey, boys! It's free software, it's democratic and cool) and his approach was horrible. And, when the damage was done, the response was "You are a awfull and trollish community! I can't understand!".

This is not Slashdot. Here you have to gain the people, and you haven't done it. At first you've come like you are the saviours of the hominkind, and as second, you response to our critics as we are childs and trolls.

This is a mature community, as we have demonstrated for months or years. If you get this response, think what have you done bad, and don't blame us as trolls.

I found Ryzom through a BBC article on Ryzom.org, went to Ryzom.org, watched a video and read the site, then came here. I don't subscribe to any "Free Soft" websites or communities, I just see merit in the idea.

I think you're right, in that I took the first responses to my post and assumed the whole community was like that, when it fact it was just one or two bad apples. Don't make the same mistake though, please don't say 'you' as if I'm Ryzom.org... I'm not affiliated at all with 'them' other than posting once on their forums.

This is the post I found childish and hostile, I challenge you to disagree.

vguerin wrote: Another new account made to publish rubbish and propoganda... this is trash and ryzom.org will be the death of our game, only giving life to open source folks... Many of us won't be here to see what ryzom.org does to our game, almost as bad as worst case scenario...

Still, I shouldn't have assumed the worst players representative of the whole. My apologies for that, maybe in future more mature and intelligent people will be the first to respond.