[DEV] Rebalancing changes - Proposition

[grimjim]

Not to be rude but for a rundish 250lvl ele what i suspect you are, its sure easy to sit on the high pedestal and say what.

It makes me a bit frusteted then players coment changes in the game they ether to high to care about or they are 100 lvls form where the changes really going to show its real face.

Elemental is too powerful from much lower than 250.

[morzyr]

Im sorry but in what way are magic too powerfull?

For a rollplayer you shure know what mages allways been the most destuctive players doing most dmg.
If not pls spend some years in some of the Ad@d or in what ever other rpg games.

Sure it may be "unfair" to the player choiceing the a other skill tree's but what is their choice, but then you can say harsvester/craftes are way to powerfull too, by the way they makes money much easyer the the figthers or mages.

If you mean they are too powerfull by the way they regen there energy or the time to cast,i follow you.
But saying its their dmg is to high i don't follow at all.

I Think it shuld be much more in fact but with more penlty with time not energy as others say in this thread.

[rushin]

around and around and around we go. i get dizzy.

maybe i can be more specific.

1) ele is overpowered compared to any other combat class
2) ele is overpowered compared to any mob of similar level to mage.

quick example; we'll do it for lv150 not lv250 as u seem to be suggesting that it only occurs at higher levels.

lv150 ele mages hits awesome kipucka or similar lv184 mob for ~1800dmg a hit, assuming lv180 la and jewels can solo will occasional need for self heals.

lv150 tank attacks similar mob in lv180 HA and jewels. Hits for ~600dmg, gets parried far more often than mage is resisted, after using self heals and MPA find mob has 60%+ of hp left and has 2 speed away screaming.

The tank situation is understandable, and in a team is acceptable.. the fact that an ele can blast mobs of far higher level with little challenge would indicate its overpowered. This situation is apparent by lv100 and just gets more pronounced as levels increase. with a lv250 2h being able to dish out ~1k.. a mage can do this dmg at lv100-110 as far as i remember

[grimjim]

Im sorry but in what way are magic too powerfull? For a rollplayer you shure know what mages allways been the most destuctive players doing most dmg.
If not pls spend some years in some of the Ad@d or in what ever other rpg games.
Sure it may be "unfair" to the player choiceing the a other skill tree's but what is their choice, but then you can say harsvester/craftes are way to powerfull too, by the way they makes money much easyer the the figthers or mages.
If you mean they are too powerfull by the way they regen there energy or the time to cast,i follow you.
But saying its their dmg is to high i don't follow at all.
I Think it shuld be much more in fact but with more penlty with time not energy as others say in this thread.

There seems to be a crux level, around 100+ where they transition to being far too powerful. They deal a massive amount of damage, and pretty quickly, able to slaughter creatures faster than anything else in the game and even before those creatures reach them. This combined with the high level of healing makes tanks etc almost redundant a lot of the time.

The best proof is that so many people gravitate towards elemental as their primary thing to level.

I would also agree that harvesters corner the money market.

I have lots of experience with various RPGs and almost without fail there are balancing factors that aren't so prevalent here.

In AD&D/D&D for example, Magi have a massive amount less hit points, they are limited very much in the number of times that they can cast, their combat skills are impaired, some spells cost permanent XP to cast, there are material components, verbal, somatic etc restrictions.

Ryzom has an advantage in being classless but does allow some abilities to outstrip their counterparts.

[petej]

There seems to be a crux level, around 100+ where they transition to being far too powerful.

Thats the Double spells (lvl 100) which will probably be useless after the Nerf and at lvl 125 the race spells

They deal a massive amount of damage, and pretty quickly, able to slaughter creatures faster than anything else in the game and even before those creatures reach them.

You have to , if the mob reaches you in your self depleted state (from casting) one hit will kill you

I would also agree that harvesters corner the money market.

A pure Forager would but he has very little costs , a Forager/Crafter does because theres virtualy nothing to buy , if there were NPC mats above q 100 Crafters would use them and hence have less money

[mmatto]

Will there be "max resist vs." values for magic like in armors?

[morzyr]

around and around and around we go. i get dizzy.

maybe i can be more specific.

1) ele is overpowered compared to any other combat class
2) ele is overpowered compared to any mob of similar level to mage.

quick example; we'll do it for lv150 not lv250 as u seem to be suggesting that it only occurs at higher levels.

lv150 ele mages hits awesome kipucka or similar lv184 mob for ~1800dmg a hit, assuming lv180 la and jewels can solo will occasional need for self heals.

lv150 tank attacks similar mob in lv180 HA and jewels. Hits for ~600dmg, gets parried far more often than mage is resisted, after using self heals and MPA find mob has 60%+ of hp left and has 2 speed away screaming.

The tank situation is understandable, and in a team is acceptable.. the fact that an ele can blast mobs of far higher level with little challenge would indicate its overpowered. This situation is apparent by lv100 and just gets more pronounced as levels increase. with a lv250 2h being able to dish out ~1k.. a mage can do this dmg at lv100-110 as far as i remember

First let me point out i think its more "playlike" to do big team and don't fancy the 2 player team or solo much.

so..

Yeah, as you say a "tank" is just what a tank or dmg buffer if you like.
His or hers 1st jobb to defend the others in the team and take the killing blows, and whats why you get more hp in the skill tree.

A magic user in say middle lvl of the skill tree in most rpg do icredible dmg allready there compared to melee and as grimjm says have to pay for it in varius ways, but can be helped by ether a channel , healer, magic shrine and so on and so on, to make the jobb easyer and less time comsuming

If ranged have worked,(does, but are increbly costly and hard to lvl) what are suposely be the counterpart of the magic user ,should be able to do massive dmg to.

But to say they are to "powerfull" is just wrong Magic users are POWERFULL.
Fighters are too then they get in the higher but in a diffrent way.( i personly think crical striks 3Xdmg, power blows and so on shuld be more nice for melee to just point out some fetures what would help the melee abit )

True a nuke/healer combo does the jobb supremly and you get the proper exp for it, not becuse the ele is to powerfull, but for it to easy to fire off 3-4 nukes in a row.

Now idely you will have a team of 2 tanks, a offencie magic user, a affiction magic user and 2 healers (and finly a ranged if it worked)
But as you all know its kind of hard to pussle all those together ingame if you not willing to spend 2 hours tping around and bring them to gether or if you lucky some in your guild fits in there

Now comes the problem, exp, all are in the same lvls and exp drops like a log and the time you use on the killing higher mobs in way to time comsuning(in my case what means allmost just looking for the rare 250+ mobs or drop down 150lvl and leach on the team ,lvling daggers or aff magic)

So what does i leave us? well the easy,safe and less time comsuming way.
So what most of the time leave us with 2 player teams ether its nuke/heal or figter/heal

So now then they force us to teams with more likewise lvl in big team they need to rebalance the exp on all the mobs too to compensate for the lose in big teams.

--------
Btw i lvl'd melee and heal high befor going for the ele magic so you not think im a pure mage.

Sorry for the grabled text... kind of slow today, hope you get my point of view

[mmatto]

I don't understand all these arguments about nerfing elemental in pve. There is couple of slight adjustements to double missiles but biggest impact is pvp only - improved magic resistance jewels. I may have missed line where they said that mobs start wearing jewels...

Elemental is now very powerful and will be still powerful after these adjustments.

[vguerin]

There isn't really a dispute that mages are typically the high end damage dealers in a D&D type RPG... However SoR allows multiclassing without a penalty anywhere for mages becoming a fighter. There are many benefits to a mage becoming a fighter and little/none for a fighter being a mage.

Hp credits in spells and the extra damage absorbtion help a mage, other than increased sap for enchants nothing is gained from a fighter leveling magery. Typically mages have little HP, in SoR they may have more than the tank and do much more damage faster.

Definately needs balancing in elemental and healing...
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[petej]

There isn't really a dispute that mages are typically the high end damage dealers in a D&D type RPG... However SoR allows multiclassing without a penalty anywhere for mages becoming a fighter. There are many benefits to a mage becoming a fighter and little/none for a fighter being a mage.

Hp credits in spells and the extra damage absorbtion help a mage, other than increased sap for enchants nothing is gained from a fighter leveling magery. Typically mages have little HP, in SoR they may have more than the tank and do much more damage faster.

Definately needs balancing in elemental and healing...[url=http://]http://[/url]

The trouble with balancing like that is you then cause everyone to have to do the very thing that is the problem