Ryzom

You already have players who have been going back and forth between the lands. We have one person in our guild who makes a decent amount of runs between the races just trading armour. So far she has had our guild crafters make at least 8 sets that I know of to be sold to trykers and she also crafts herself. That is only what I know about and I am still a low level light armour crafter.


Once trade is opened up more these issues will be not be as bad. They still will not be right, but at least the market will be more even across the lands.

I am still not sure I like the idea of high level vendor mats, But I do think they should eventually put up to lvl 100 on the vendors.

Frankly I myself don't want to see 100 mats on vendors. People are so lazy that they can't be bothered to gather mats or get guildmates to gather mats for them. All the vendor mats do is allow them to park their butt in one place for hours at a time. There is more interaction between the guild and the crafters without those mats. As for the solo crafter. Lets face it, there is no solo after level 100, you need a guild to survive. Doing it alone is no fun. If you want to solo go play a single player game. MMORPGs are for meeting and grouping with people. If you want to play casually thats fine. If you want to solo thats fine. But don't expect to be able to keep up.

korin77 wrote:Frankly I myself don't want to see 100 mats on vendors. People are so lazy that they can't be bothered to gather mats or get guildmates to gather mats for them. All the vendor mats do is allow them to park their butt in one place for hours at a time. There is more interaction between the guild and the crafters without those mats. As for the solo crafter. Lets face it, there is no solo after level 100, you need a guild to survive. Doing it alone is no fun. If you want to solo go play a single player game. MMORPGs are for meeting and grouping with people. If you want to play casually thats fine. If you want to solo thats fine. But don't expect to be able to keep up.

Very much agree. Even the addition of the q50 vendor mats wasnt needed in my opinion. Crafting actually takes a little bit of work and dedication to do well and adding in even more vendor mats just dumbs down the system even farther.

There is one issue I think we have all been tip toeing around. We talk about lack of mats, but most talk about how crafters just can't keep up with the fast leveling of the fighters and mages. (I will give Tyker their due, their land is a piece of %^%$$. They have other problems) How much stuff do we actually get mats for and make a piece of equipment and get it to someone in need, and how much stuff is just "grind" junk made to add exp.

I think the idea behind the craft system and all its branching was that a player might make "helms" and another make "boots". This isn't happening and I don't think it ever will. Players want to make full sets of armor to sell into the market. Few players want to go to 6 different people to complete their suit of armor.

Why does crafting have to be such a grinding no fun experience in every game I play? The solution seems to be that in order to thin out the number of crafters to create a real economy, we will make it such a chore, that only a few hardcore players will do it. People talk about dedication and such. We don't get any medals at the end. I dont' get a check for $500. MAKE CRAFTING EASIER. Let the levels fly like harvesting. So what there are 100 crafters at level 250. Everyone has equipment now.

In the end crafting is a brutal competative process. player vs player at its emotional worst. There are more people who would like to be crafters than there are who will be successful. The "grind" is what makes most people quit, but if there were no grind, people would still have to quit. The market would be flooded with goods and then price wars would start. Crafters would give up because it woudn't be worth their time to make the stuff. In the end the process of finding the balance of the number of crafters and demand, is a survial of the fitest "grindfest". I say that no matter what system is used, you are going to have unhappy people, but at least they didn't waste hours and hours of time.

kisedd wrote:I say that no matter what system is used, you are going to have unhappy people, but at least they didn't waste hours and hours of time.

The problem is risk vs reward.

Crafters have 0 risk yet they always have high rewards at least for the people who stick with it. So in order to balance the skills, you need to have a major drawback. This is often two things .. time and money.. Which basicly comes down to time. One way to decrease the amount of time actually spent grinding is add in a Dap cost to the actual crafting process (not just the cost of the mats). Then increasing the leveling rate to account for this. This shifts the time you spend crafting to the time you spend making money so you can craft.

I actually believe a shift in the amount of foraged mats alone would suffice and should have been done from the beginning.

What if Foragers could get 4x the mats starting from level 1? Quality and xp concerns aside because those can be worked out.

The reason against vendor mats, is it simply removes quartered and foraged mats from the game. Crafters don't want to take the time or effort to go out finding them if things can just be bought. Trying to make crafting less fun so as to only appeal to the hardcore is definately a way of ruining the game though.

I at least don't see why more forage mats shouldn't be tried, if it still needs more we can give it more then.

svayvti wrote: I at least don't see why more forage mats shouldn't be tried, if it still needs more we can give it more then.

I have been offering the way to do this without directly effecting the market for crafted items. Just make it a multiplier by the class of the source .. Maybe add it to the Mat spec skill to make those skills usefull. This would give a reason to harvest basic and fine mats. It would help solve the issue with crafters needing high amounts of grinding mats. I really dont see why they wouldnt do it. It isnt like QTY adds much XP to the pull.

My experience crafting has been different than many here so far. I can't speak to the Tyker issues, as I play a Zorai, but...


Player Composition in Servers Driving Economy
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I haven't had a problem providing enough stuff to meet demand, from what I can tell. I'm making 100 amps and 2h swords and 80 light armor. Rather, I've been making too much if anything. When going from level 85 to 90 in melee crafting, I made 50 q90 swords. Problem was, I could only sell about 5 of them. I made them all from choice-supreme mats since I had to harvest the mats anyways, I didn't see the point in harvesting inferior stuff since it takes the same amount of time. And after selling 5 of them, I got lucky if I could give them away.

The composition of the Windermeer community seemed to be the limiting factor. It appears that a bulk of the community playing now is the diehard fans that have been here since day 1. Because all crafters are leveling more slowly that melee players, demand is highest for the goods that the current highest level crafter makes. For example, when I was making q90 swords to level, the highest level swords available in Zorai were q130. At that time, many were clamoring for q140 and q150. Short of getting those, they settled for q130. There was almost no interest in the q90 stuff.

Anyways, I haven't seen a large influx of new players into the NA server. I don't think there are lots of lower and mid level players that will be driving demand in the near future. So I expect the pattern of high demand for the highest quality items and little demand for goods right below that to continue indefinitely.

To Many Combines Required to Level
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Well, the XP system for the game as a whole continues to baffle me. I would get the 3K XP cap if every level required the same amount of experience as the one before it. Instead, each new level requires more XP, elongating the grind with every step. I tend not to notice it so much fighting or harvesting, but with crafting it has become onerous.

Lets face it, the crafting interface is tedious. You click on make item a hundred times and then if your lucky, you get a flash of light saying you gained a new level. Woohoo. I guess the challenge comes in that the game likes to foget what you used to craft the last item, so you have to go pick it from you inventory again--probably to prevent you from clicking make item too easily? So the challenge is what, not to pick the wrong item to craft with by mistake in your haste to get done crafting and get back with the game?

With crafting, the reward comes entirely from what you have accomplished, that wonderful item you crafted that has perfect stats and is 10q higher than your last best effort. Contrast that with fighting or magic, where your reward is the process of earning that XP, in the fight itself. So long as the crafting process remains the exercise is boredom that it is right now, it would be rather nice if it too fewer successful combines to level. Instead, with every new level the required number of successful combines increases. That seems punitive, and destined to drive many out of the profession.

Anyways, these are just my observations of crafting so far. Overall, I'm pretty bored with it. I can't say I'm all that concerned with getting new crafter levels at this point. I can make a 100 amp. Anything higher and I wont get XP cause of the bug in amp crafting. I can make 80 armor. That will degrade so fast that why even wear it?