[Closed] Innovate: replace the Chat tool with something tottaly different !

[browserice]

Anyone willing to help or learn ?

Also, if this idea is accepted by Spiderweb, I need to know the O/S it will be running on that server. If I can set it up on the same O/S, it would make things a lot simpler to transfer everything if it is accepted.



Y a-t-il du monde qui veulent aider ou apprendre ?

Également, si cette idée est accpetée par Spiderweb, j'ai besoin de savoir le type de O/S qui va rouler sur ce serveur. Si je peux tout configurer sur le même O/S, ça serait beaucoup plus simple à transférer si c'est accepté.

[nanaruto]

Je suis vraiment mauvais en informatique , mais de quoi a tu besoin pour aider?

[browserice]

Je suis vraiment mauvais en informatique , mais de quoi a tu besoin pour aider?

Une fois le serveur monté, la plartie la plus lente est de batir ce monde. Ceci fait petit à petit. Tu construit chaque composante avec des objects primitifs devant toi et tu les connectes ensemble pour former une structure (il y a d'autres moyens,mais compliqués pour quelqu'un qui n'a jamais fait ça). Donc ceci demande de la main-d'oeuvre pour le faire. Je ne dis pas que je n'y arriverai pas. Je suis capable de tout faire moi-même, mais ceci peut prendre du temps, car dans mes temps libres, j'ai plein de projets (incluant pour avancer ma carrière). C'était aussi une invitation à tout ceux qui désirent apprendre comment c'est fait. Peut-être qu'il y a des gens qui pense à ce diriger vers ce travail ? Dans le plus pire des sénarios, je ferais tout moi-même.

Once the server is set up and functional, most of the work is to build this world. This is done little by little. You build each componants with primitive objects in front of you and you then combine them into structures (there are other ways but its complicated for someone who never did this). So this demands manual work done by people. I am not saying I cannot do this. I am capable of doing everything myself, but this takes time and my free times are already full of projects (including to advance my career). It was also an invitation to anyone being curious on how this is done so they could learn how to do it. Maybe some people are already thinking of heading that way. In the worst scenario, I will do everything myself.

[ajsuk]

If it isn't broken, don't fix it.

Nail on the head.

You haven't convinced me at all, I'm still thinking "Crazy?". Sure it'd be different, maybe even innovative, but it's a freaking chat support tool.
People just want a small and simple.

Lets save the innovation for the actual product.

[browserice]

Nail on the head.

You haven't convinced me at all, I'm still thinking "Crazy?". Sure it'd be different, maybe even innovative, but it's a freaking chat support tool.
People just want a small and simple.

Lets save the innovation for the actual product.

The thing is, everywhere around me in the company and in hundreds of company, people are talking about Virtual Reality as the next big trend. Projects are poping up everywhere. They say by 2010, 25% of the population will be using Virtual Reality. A lot of companies see big oportunities to make money in it. This concept might be a bit hard for you to understand but we are getting there a lot faster then you think. In 2 years, you will hear and see a lot of references to Virtual Reality in companies, big stores, Online sellers, distributers, big IT companies, Coca Cola, Disney, Sears, Dell, IBM, ...

So far, some game companies are already starting to implement Virtual Reality. It won't be long before all support services are replaced by Virtual Reality, it already started...

Besides, the decision is up to Spiderweb.

[ajsuk]

I get that it's the next big thing and you like it because you happen to be working on it but in 2 years time my connection speed will still more than likely be crap(ish) and I wont want to wait an hour to download a _support_ tool.

And yes, it is ultimately SW's decision but there's nothing wrong with discussing things and possibly preventing them making big mistakes.

[iceaxe68]

browserice may seem a bit over the top in his enthusiasm, and it's true that CeB works. I do think, though, that a little substantive discussion might be useful.

I approach this with the following perspective:

• I spent several years delivering, and then managing and designing end-user and developer technical support, using a variety of delivery methods.
• I am an avid Ryzom player, and frequently assist newer players with technical issues in an unofficial capacity. (As do many of us.)
• I am experienced with the tools browserice is espousing, namely opensim, and the SecondLife simulator and development tools system, both as a general user and as a content developer.

First of all, let me say that the direct communication provided by chat tools is extremely valuable. It is in many ways superior to telephone support, especially given the multi-lingual environment we are in.

A virtual reality system does offer that same functionality, and additionally offers numerous additional capabilities. There are also some drawbacks that I see.

Benefits:

• A richer set of communication and instruction tools, including images, sound, and video.
• Scripted interactions for common issues. (A form of FAQ with all of the above capabilities.)
• A more comfortable environment for non-technical users, particularly those experienced with 3D games.

Drawbacks:

• Bandwidth usage. While the bandwidth requirements can be reduced by careful planning, some assets (notably video streams) require bandwidth well above that required for simple text.
• Learning curve. While text chat has its own learning curve, it is still a bit more familiar to most than the more complex UI of a 3D virtual space. That may change in the future as VR becomes more familiar to users, as hypertext has over the last 15 years, but not yet. In any case, the UI and controls of the suggested system are somewhat different than the UI and controls of Ryzom, which may lead to some degree of confusion. This bears some further discussion, but I won't belabor it now.
• Higher maintenance costs for the system. An opensim server takes more upkeep than a chat server, plain and simple. Neither is hugely expensive to maintain, but scaling applies multipliers, and we all hope for a need to scale, yes?

Personally, I think it would be a worthwhile experiment, but I don't think it's a sure win.

[jarnar]

Ok as this thread is addressing a Virtual Reality Chat I have to address this as well:
I say this is a very good idea... but you're too late sadly... we already have one it's called "client_ryzom_rd.exe" and has already had a lot of updates (patches) it's been around since the times of the beta - really it's already that old!

Now continuing to replacing the chat in general:

Replacing the support chat with something with more features might be nice, but those features would have to optional - I would suggest a moddified Jabber/XMPP service. It supports everything a chat needs and additionally VoIP so everyone could either use his/her preffered jabber client or the "enhanced" ryzom client (maybe with additional options).

Positive points:
possibility for P2P communication (low server load)
possibility for VoIP (yay! new feature)

Negative points:
no chatroom from start (it's thought as IM, not chat)
need of email address for auth (no big thing -> username@ryzom.com or register a new domain like atysian.com ... homin.com is already taken by some jpn church)

The old Klients 1.33 had some nice features as well, like a whiteboard to paint something for others... though the newer version of the plugin was bugged and spammed the receiver when drawing something.

The drawback with those things though is that it won't give any special attention to the game as it's nothing too big... well one could do marketing with "the first MMORPG that gives email-adresses to all of its users" but I don't think that it would make a good marketing strategy.

[Boar]

Version Anglaise:
Thinking about it, I have one question to the Dev team. Just how much look-a-like would be tolerated in this Virtual Reality as to no go against the copyright or intellectual property laws ?

French version:
En y pensant un peu, j'ai une question à l'équipe des Dev. Juqu'à quelle limite la ressemblance serait tolérée dans cette Réalité Virtuelle pour ne pas aller contre le droit d'auteur ou la loi de propriété intellectuelle ?

I spoke with the Ryzom Team and they do not like the idea of having a copy of Ryzom in another Virtual Reality. There are already 2 chats, support and ingame and we think it's enough for now.

/Boar

[browserice]

I spoke with the Ryzom Team and they do not like the idea of having a copy of Ryzom in another Virtual Reality. There are already 2 chats, support and ingame and we think it's enough for now.

/Boar

So in other words, this means this idea is dropped. It did generate interesting comments/replies and that was one point of it. Ideas can come out of discussions.

Then can we engage in a similar discussion from one point that came out of this ? What about the "client_ryzom_rd.exe" that some refered to ?

I assume it is one of the 2 chats tools you mentioned. Is there something planed to improve/change it ?

Personnaly I never used it so I have no idea how it looks like.