aardnebb wrote:Sadly this is going to eventually result in all OPs being owned by one faction in the end, as the guilds owning OPs tend to get more recruits, so they get bigger, they win more battles with their allies, so they have more friends with OPs... See where this is going?
Do you think that the folks with the perceived power (read unity) do not realize this. There is a desire for Outpost battles on both sides, not an all out routing.
I think more than anyhting, this proves the diplomacy in Outposts. The Unified group you haev seen has put litterally hundreds of hours of work into that unity since the outposts have begun. Arguing, fighting, bikkering, compromise, and many other adjectives could be used to descibe the diplomacy this group has worked on. Many players spend well over 75% of their time in game nowadays working on this diplomatic side.
I think the groups being outgunned have not spent the time and effort on this side (the diplomatic side) of the OP's in advance, and tries to summon great powers when the moment of truth (war has been declared) arrives.
As a side note, I do not see any guild in the group with the supposed advantage owning 2 OPs.
Noin.
~ Noinossalg (Noin to most) ~ OmegaV ~ King Of Nexus ~
~ Adventurer First ~ Home: Windermeer ~ Residence: Arispotle ~
~ The Windermeer Male Fashion Show Champion ~
~ Ubi major, minor cessat - The weak capitulate before the strong ~
Is there a big difference between an alliance and a faction in the way it's being played ? There are just as many (non)faction players not in an alliance on all sides. If these battles were truly faction, then there would not be faction members opposing each other as is currently happening. That in itself shows thse are not faction battles as things are not rigid.
All we have seen to this point is alliance battles...
aardnebb wrote:In my experience OP battles do tend to be a little one-sided. One faction tends to outnumber the other, resulting in most battles being decided simply by the number of players showing up on each side, the overall outcome is often obvious in the first 5 minutes of the battle unless a large group turns up late.
now.. i say the obvios thing that nobody wants to say. most probably because the flames that follow:
if you weak (guild, alliances, etc), you dont deserve outpost
it's that simple. grow in numbers or be prepared to lose.
Gather some friends untill YOU outnumber the other side and whip their A***s!
Just like back in the Schoolyard fights. And there´ll even be the fondly remembered "calling of names" involved, and surely some people standing by and gawking, or cheering one or the other side.
And at some point a teacher (GM) will show up and try to sort through the storm of accusations and hilarious ranting.
Aahhh, the good ol´ days.
Acridiel
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reading this its kinda funny, you have 2 sides. One side is complaing that as a faction they are outnumbered severely and somethings gotta be done before the larger side takes over everything in the game. The other side is saying that the smaller side is just complaining and they need to work on alliances more, and ofcource they love their advantage.
last nite at the malmot farm battle the "kami" side was outnumbered around 2-1 by the "karavan" side. The OP's are supposed to be GvG, but reality is they are FvF, mabey not intended that way, but its the way it is. Now from what i'm seeing, the karavan side is almost feeling that they are "allowing" the kami side to keep some of what they have, but showing the force that they can take what they want when they want, and i believe they can..through shear numbers.
This is a good look to the future when the new spires come live..The dominant side can control whatever region they want whenever they want.
So, what's a homin to do. Do I just give in, work my fame the other way and join the winning team? Do I stay where i am, train harder, help newer players become stronger for my side? Do I just say piss on all this and find a new game?
Even if OP battles had limits on participants its not going to matter when entire regions are at stake. The kara side can just secure their homelands then when that is under control they can force their way through kami lands and still take what OP they want by controling the region its in.
I'm don't know if it was intended in the game to have one faction heavily outnumber the other, but that could prove very discouraging to the weaker side and cause a lot of poeple to opt to piss on all that and find a new game. What good is new content after months of grinding if you can't access it just because the "side your on" doesn't have sufficient numbers to gain access to it from the other.
This could be the end of factions just as the faction war starts...who's gonna want to continually lose? Seems if you want to win, you have to join the winning team, or just sit back grind levels, keep quiet ,settle for what you do have,and hope it isn't taken from you.
I'm still undecided what i want to do. I have thought about abandoning my friends to join the winning team, after all why would i want to pay 15 bucks a month to lose, but that would suck being the jerk that left my own behind lke that.
So anyone..either side..tell me, whats a poor confused homin to do?
I think fraction has become more important but some people still work on friendship, my personal view on outposts is remove them, they have brought nothing good to the game except for the fun in PvP which is usual just spam healing/nuking and often extremly one sided, the OP rewards are nice but mean the people in powerful guilds get more powerful and people who have worked hard at their lvls over a long time are all of a sudern over looked as good players. unless gaurds are balenced and only "allies" can help attack/defend comes into play Out posts will disapoint nearly everyone.
kostika wrote:No Outposts are supposed to be GvG, not FvF. It's the players who have made them FvF.
OP wars are faction oriented or not. Kamis try to get all OP they can and karas the same. You can read it in text when you load you char. You also can just take them being a neutral guild, but of course kamis and karas do right if they just want to take karas or neutral Op, cause that its clearly said in the text i mentioned. There is a war between karas and kamis and they must get all resources they can.
The wheel will turn again and and again, one side will overpower or outnumber the other at one time or another. If you don't like the game design that allows diplomacy and networking to mean even more than high level players and elite equipment, all I can say is, I disagree with you there.
It's about will as much as numbers. When we first arrived at Malmont, we were the ones outnumbered 2:1, but we never thought of giving up. As the rounds continued, I noticed a diminishing of the defenders' numbers over time as ours just continued to grow. If you'd kept all of the people you started with, you might have successfully defended, but many of them seemed to have left.
When the spires go live, we'll all live in a quite different world. However, don't assume that the Karavan will is going to exist to place spires in the jungle and desert lands. Even supposing we still have superior numbers, the world is just way too big for us to concentrate on all regions of the game. In fact, I'm sure that most of us don't want it that way - remember that the FvF fan requires challenging fights to stay interested in the FvF. You notice how many Karavan replied to Infinity's goodbye thread and asked them to think about coming back?
The Kami are hurting in numbers just now, but that is not a valid reason to change the mechanics of the outpost battles. Their numbers will grow again, and as we have already seen, most of the so called neutrals are also siding with the Kami faction guilds, which means they aren't quite the underdog you're representing them as even now, with one of the most powerful Kami guilds gone from the game.
One thing I do not support is the call to dumb down the PvP systems we have in place now. Aside from some annoying bugs and a couple of exploits that need to be blocked, the best group PvP is set up exactly like the outposts - if you force it into a "pick teams" scenario it will exclude all but the most elite and high level among us, and that would truly be a disaster.
Rather, keep forming your networks and alliances and come back stronger.
kostika wrote:No Outposts are supposed to be GvG, not FvF. It's the players who have made them FvF.
Sorry Kost, but to paraphrase everyone's favorite "mercenary"; Once you release an MMO, its out of your hands and into the hands of the players
Oh and on another note, I hope you all got paid well for your time yesterday (and again tonight) - I'd hate to think of the damage all this fighting is doing to your nice gear
sprite wrote:Sorry Kost, but to paraphrase everyone's favorite "mercenary"; Once you release an MMO, its out of your hands and into the hands of the players
I was clarifying a point of misconception. Nothing ever survives the players.
