Ryzom

At least we agree on that.

Umm.... on what?

First you say: don't choose, just do what I say. Then you agree with: choose for yourself...? I see two conflicting statements there... unless you mean you agree with having a choice as long as it is what you would agree with (i.e. Karavan). If that is the case then you confirm my above point, thank you kindly.

madnak wrote:Liquado, I'm sorry to see that you have fallen so far so fast. You don't even remember the ideal of unity which, though foolish when applied to the Kami, was admirable. And now you listen to their lies. I'll have you know I have personally cleaned goo away from the land in service of the Karavan - they are very active in preserving the planet. Even in Verdant Heights, where the goo is a minor threat.

Unfortunately this ideal was flawed from the start. As a unity-minded individual, not trying to lean towards either side, I noticed that the Karavan are incapable of this. I was pronounced foolish by your people, why supported by the Kami followers. I wanted also, at first, to ignore the fact that the Karavan are nothing like what they claim. I do not doubt that Jena is a benevolent godess, and that what she does is good, I doubt your true allegience with her. You're being mislead my friend, and it's time to come home. The Kami are not only of this planet, but also part of it, if Karavan intentions were good wouldn't they embrace assistance from the Karavan? It seems the Karavan have come here and immediately intended upon opposing the Kami, and they encourage the hasty, greedy destruction of our planet instead of resource management. I am sorry, but I cannot agree with these actions that rape my HOME of its life. I have faith in the Kami, and their ability to see through the Karavan lies even better than I do. Please my friend, try it once, turn away from the lies, contact me and we'll get together and I'll show you the true way. You needn't fear the Kami, but embrace them.

but didn't the Kami and the Karavan both helped us homins in our dark time, where we faced xenocide from the Kitins?

Anyhow, I guess it would be wrong of me to base my alliances on beauty alone (lord knows the Kami aint that pretty!), but then again ... your heart can't tell you wrong, can it?

To avoid declaring for either group is still a choice. I'm just suggesting there are more than two choices to make. He doesn't have to abandon his home or Jena. I agree that he should act according to his principles.

The Kami oppose the Karavan, who represent Jena. Therefore they are my enemies. I would be happy if the Kami embraced Jena. But they declared Jena a false god, Usurper of Ma'Duk. I think they want to control or destroy the homins; they see us as a plague on their lands. I think they want us alive to stop the kitin and the Karavan, and then they will attack us.

At least we can all agree that the kitin must be stopped.

Does that not also mean that the Karavan might also be misleading us? They teach of Jena, and they are good teachings, but they say they are representitives of Jena. We have no more proof that they are representatives of Jena than we do that the Kami are waiting for us to wipe the scourge of the Kittin from our lands forever, before turning on us homin. The pritty words are just that. There actions, however...

<Noh, Zorai>
<2 different players on this one account>

The Karavan seek to protect all homins and care for homins for they themselves are of homin form. Karavan followers such as the Matis promote science which the Kami have tried to interfere with. Kami promotes thought only as long as it promotes their unknown agenda. These demon Kami can not be trusted. The Kami accuse the Karavan of not sharing technology. If one would stop and think for a minute, one would realize that Karavan technology and crafting is dependent on metels which so far have not been found on Atys. The Karavan have also proven their wisdom. Did they not advise homins to stay out of the prime roots? Was it not the Fyros who ignored such wisdom and provoked the kitin? The Karavan do promote science but also demand that homins pay heed to their wisdom. As for Karavan benevolence, I have personally seen Karavan gaurdians fight the Kitin in the nexus where I did earn the title of Karavan Champion for my help in protecting all homins. The strange Karavan weapons did tear through the kitin faster than my own Matisian launcher.

The Kami use the politics of fear to trick homins to wage war on homins. Fear denies faith. I have faith in the Karavan who have proven beyond all doubt that they will protect homins. I do not know what the Kami are and I do not need to know. I do not know what thier agenda is and I do not need to know. I do not know why they are opposed to Matis science and I do not need to know. I do not know why anyone would worship these inhomin things and I do not need to know. I do know that any homin who would attack the followers of the Karavan is an enemy of all homins and must be destroyed.
_______________
Ivarion
Gladius Jenae

jgi47ak wrote:The Karavan seek to protect all homins and care for homins for they themselves are of homin form.
...
These demon Kami can not be trusted.
...
The Kami use the politics of fear to trick homins to wage war on homins.
...
I do not know why anyone would worship these inhomin things and I do not need to know.

The Karavan maybie of homin form, but so are the Kami. Seeing as how I have yet to see any Kami attacking a homin, I doubt that they could be classified as demons. You confuse the Kami with certain disagreeable Kami-suporting homin. The Kami themselves I have yet to hear a truely fear-inspireing thing, although the bit about how the Karavan technology causes harm to the plants that we depend on for life is a bit troubling. And finaly, the Kami are not inhomin. Just as there are many forms of homin, there are many forms of Kami. Do they not still walk uppon two legs? Do they not still have two arms? Are they incapeable of speach, like the Gingo or the Mektoub? No. They may be a little odd looking sometimes, but then again, since they are closer to magic than any of the four tribes, that is to be expected. You don't exactly see me running around, saying Tryker are inhomin, simply because they are shorter than my people, nor do you see me calling Matisans inhomin, simply because their skin is not blue like my peoples. So what makes the Kami different?

jgi47ak wrote:Karavan followers such as the Matis promote science which the Kami have tried to interfere with. Kami promotes thought only as long as it promotes their unknown agenda.
...
The Kami accuse the Karavan of not sharing technology. If one would stop and think for a minute, one would realize that Karavan technology and crafting is dependent on metels which so far have not been found on Atys.
...
The Karavan do promote science but also demand that homins pay heed to their wisdom.
...
I do not know why they are opposed to Matis science and I do not need to know.

Again, it is not the Kami that accuse the Karavan of not shairing their crafting secrets, but some Kami-followers. Learning to differentuate between the two is a very important step to proper learning. As for being opposed to Matis 'science', it realy depends on what you are talking about. The matis 'science' that is similar to that of the Tryker, the Fyros, and the Zorai is accepted with no problem. When you bring in 'science' that is based on Karavan crafting, that is when the Kami have problems. Was there realy all that need to force Atys to create a wall for your defense? Every land has it's own natural defenses already in place. If you had just worked with them, instead of forceing into an unnatural shape, there would have been no problem. Since the Karavan 'science' is based on different materials, which probably need to be forced to conform, why use it here, where there is no need? As for the promoting thought only so long as it follows their master plan, the Karavan can be accused of the same thing. You, yourself admitted that the Karavan demand that one heeds their wisdom. And what do the Kami do? They let you make your own mistakes, all the while watching you to make shure that you don't grevously hurt yourself, like a parent. How is that only promoting the way of thinking that follows their 'master plan'?

And finaly,

jgi47ak wrote:I do know that any homin who would attack the followers of the Karavan is an enemy of all homins and must be destroyed.

No, this is homin is an enimy of the followers of the Karavan. Not all homin bend their knee to the Karavan, so saying that an enimy of the Karavan is the enimy of all is blatantly false. Now, if they attack Karavan-alligned and Kami-alligned alike, like the Kittin do, THEN they are the enimy of all homin-kind. But if they only attack Karavan, then they are only the enimy of the Karavan.

Noh
A humble Zorai

Fyros Brothers and Sisters of the Kami
The Karavan seem to be making Our Desert a comforable visiting area. Every day i see more and more of the Karavan taint seeping into our homeland a Karavan ship has even landed in our dunes offering quick teleport pacts for the tainted to invade our lands! Brothers and Sisters it is under a KM from our City of Thesos do not think this is a hand of peace. The Karavan are deceptive and will wait for the strong to turn their backs on them to slide the dagger into our backs.

The Gaurdian
Cerberous

The Karavan and their followers are sheep. They are thusly named. What do they follow? Only those aligned with the Karavan know. The rest of us have real concerns like the goo and the well being of our fellows and world to attend to. I'd smash their followers to bits but that'd be like picking off the Yubolings following their scampering mother to hide from the rain. It's the head I want. The head of the Karavan!

The Karavan ARE but sheep. And these sheep are ready for the slaughter.