Why should anyone be able to choose a faction when doing anything???

[josephm]

Of course that means your 'fame' with the East Germans would never go back up if you side with the British. They'd kill you, and take all your spawn points.

Raynes I got it. You didn't read it. Read after this part about sports. Then try really hard and remember that this is a game...what's a sport? oh yeah. A game.

[angus858]

Raynes I got it. You didn't read it. Read after this part about sports. Then try really hard and remember that this is a game...what's a sport? oh yeah. A game.

Fighting in the PR and during events has never been described by the GM's as a game. It is a war between factions or at least a fight to the death between individuals. Raynes' analogy is much better and his complaints are valid.

I suppose that some would prefer to ignore the RP aspects of this mmoRPg and play boths sides on a whim. But that degrades everything about this game that made it attractive to me. Like many others, I was attracted by the promise of a good story... a saga. That requires a certain amount of realism regarding factional allegiance. May I suggest an alternative for folks who want to flip-flop between sides in a conflict? Have two characters and choose the appropriate character to join the side you want to support for any particular battle.

I hope the devs fix this problem by either (1) removing our ability to choose faction on entering pvp areas or (2) making traitors lose all positive fame they had with their old faction permanently (not reset after the event).

[hubba1]

I have not read the entire thread so please forgive me. Here is my short take though.

Raynes, I agree that you should not be able to choose sides for any actions with consequences in-game. But there is a problem in this situation.

In Faction vs Faction PvP, you will have a limited number of players fighting it out pretty much by choice (some will choose not to take part in this PvP). So what is the problem? Player numbers.

Lets say that you have 30 players at 9pm who are famed with the Kami and 10 players famed with the Karavan. The Kami side kicks the Karavan butt for an hour and the numbers stay the same. Over the months, we realize that for some reason Kami faction has 2-3 times as many players.

That creates a Faction vs Faction imbalance that isn't a great deal of fun in mass PvP.

So I'm GUESSSING that the right to choose is put in there for two reasons:

1) To Allow for Self-balancing PvP
2) So that a player can destroy their own fame ratings.

Overall, I think Raynes is right though and that this freedom to choose may have to be restricted in certain ways. MMORPGs tend to learn this later rather than sooner.

Just my off the cuff thoughts. You may now throw that rock at the screen.

[raynes]

I have not read the entire thread so please forgive me. Here is my short take though.

Raynes, I agree that you should not be able to choose sides for any actions with consequences in-game. But there is a problem in this situation.

In Faction vs Faction PvP, you will have a limited number of players fighting it out pretty much by choice (some will choose not to take part in this PvP). So what is the problem? Player numbers.

Lets say that you have 30 players at 9pm who are famed with the Kami and 10 players famed with the Karavan. The Kami side kicks the Karavan butt for an hour and the numbers stay the same. Over the months, we realize that for some reason Kami faction has 2-3 times as many players.

That creates a Faction vs Faction imbalance that isn't a great deal of fun in mass PvP.

So I'm GUESSSING that the right to choose is put in there for two reasons:

1) To Allow for Self-balancing PvP
2) So that a player can destroy their own fame ratings.

Overall, I think Raynes is right though and that this freedom to choose may have to be restricted in certain ways. MMORPGs tend to learn this later rather than sooner.

Just my off the cuff thoughts. You may now throw that rock at the screen.

Yes, but in this game where the players are suppose to have such a huge impact on the story, if there are more Kami followers than Karavan so be it. Write the Karavan out and move the story ahead accordingly.

Or better yet, if the Kami have so many more followers do something to make the Karavan so much more appealing. Have them come down and give their followers laser guns or something.

[kisedd]

From what cerest explained to me in klient this is mostly correct (you would still incur any normal fame gain/loss that was achieved during the event to your permanant fame).

It's PvP. So far in this game they are trying to make PvP more of a neutral event to a player. You don't get dp, you don't loose equipment if you die to another player etc. They are trying to encourage people like me, who think PvP is for griefers, powergamers, and a lot of other negative things, to give it a try.

If there is an event (I have no idea what the event would be about) you are choosing sides in a flag football game. It's not about world altering events. It's just fun.

From what I understand, if you are Kami and have all this fame you have worked years for doing missions and kissing butts, and you enter some PvP event that will determine the fate of the world, and you choose Karavan, you are going to face the results of this action.
Your fame will change. The Kami will like you less and the Karavan like you more through your actions.

In the end they may please nobody. You may quit because the game isn't super realisatic and I may quit because I'm not having fun.

[lariva]

Someone from Dev team should post C / C++ code related to fame... this might be a bit more productive then asking questions and getting invalid/incomplete answers.

I give up, even with Zzei talking to Celest, asking for clarity on how it works, and Zzei coming back with what I had posted was mostly correct with the modification of the fact that personal faction will change permanently based on event factions, and your still doubting it, there is nothing more I can say in regards to trying to describe it.

As far as ATS, it was all player events that we goofed off with that I participated in and saw the results from entering / exiting the pvp areas.

I appologize that I couldn't be any clearer, I am not good with describing how things work, well, as I see how they are working.

*shrugs shoulders*

Just wait for an event in Atys to occur and see what happens to your faction, before, during and after the event.

[cerest]

Ok, this is the official info I got:

http://ryzom.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9085

[raynes]

Ok, this is the official info I got:

http://ryzom.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9085

Yes, but when they are done with their fight (leave the event), does the faction they didn't choose return to it's previous level or does it stay. In otherwords I go to an event, my kami fame is +99, Karavan is -99. I pick Karavan for the event. It changes my fame levels to +100 Karavan, -1 Kami. After the event is over does my fame go back to +99 Kami, and -99 Karavan? Or does it stay at +100 Karavan, -1 Kami (not including any changes made for kills during the fight).

If it does change and stay, what is to stop me from entereing an event changing my faction, leaving, then 2 minutes later going in and changing to the other side? Aslo what about all the related factions? Take Zorai for example. If I do normal missions I get fame credit for about 6 different tribes. If I go into an event where I go against Zorai, do all the other factions drop as well?

[plarfman]

An example...

I have 64 kami fame, and a 61 karavan.

At the start of the event, I join up with karavan. My fame will now be 61 karavan and -1 kami. At the end of the event (baring any changes to my fame during the event) I would have 64 kami fame and 61 karavan fame again once the event was over.

If i had gained 5 karavan fame during the event, I would leave with 66 karavan and 59 kami.

Now if I had a 99 karavan fame and a -99 kami. And if I were then to join up on the kami side, my fame would switch to -99 kami and -100 karavan. At the end of the event, I would revert to 99 karavan and -99 kami (baring any changes in fame during the event).

If I had gained 5 kami fame during the event, I would leave with a 94 karavan and -94 kami fame.

I hope this clears it up a little.

Zzeii put it best perhaps this will make some sence to you.

[cerest]

Yes, but when they are done with their fight (leave the event), does the faction they didn't choose return to it's previous level or does it stay. In otherwords I go to an event, my kami fame is +99, Karavan is -99. I pick Karavan for the event. It changes my fame levels to +100 Karavan, -1 Kami. After the event is over does my fame go back to +99 Kami, and -99 Karavan? Or does it stay at +100 Karavan, -1 Kami (not including any changes made for kills during the fight).

No, these are permanent effects on your fame.

If it does change and stay, what is to stop me from entereing an event changing my faction, leaving, then 2 minutes later going in and changing to the other side? Aslo what about all the related factions? Take Zorai for example. If I do normal missions I get fame credit for about 6 different tribes. If I go into an event where I go against Zorai, do all the other factions drop as well?

Say you have 50 fame in Karavan and 49 Kami before entering the event and you choose Karavan as your faction the first time you enter, your fame will change to 50 Karavan (this doesn't change until you kill someone on the opposite side, in which case it goes up) and -1 Kami (this will go down throughout the event as you kill as well).

If you feel wishy washy and decide that you want to fight for the Kami during this same event this is what will happen. Your earned fame that you just got for fighting for the Karavan is going to drop to below the Kami fame which by this point is way below zero. So it wouldn't do you much good to switch back and forth, unless you want to have negative fame accross the board, but I wouldn't understand actually wanting that.

The factions being fought against each other in these events, remember these will be events and only turned on at certain times, are only Kami and Karavan.