Opinions on Changes in Free Trial

[chessack]

I think we need to understand that at a basic level pretty much all of us are in agreement: the freeloaders need to be encouraged to "move on" from Ryzom, and the trial needs in some way to be attractive to those who would actually pay provided they find the trial attractive. And we ALL want Nevrax and Ryzom to succeed and make money because we love it.

What we are arguing about here, is what the best way is to do that. I will readily agree that the island, as it sat before this latest patch, might not have accomplished all of the above stated goals, most particularly being a bit lax in allowing freeloaders to have a cool sort of "mini-game" that enabled them to basically play for months and months without paying. My argument is not that this situation needed to be rectified, but that the level 21 cap is an absolutely horrifyingly bad way of rectifying it.

People have brought up what other MMOs do (I have also), but as I said earlier, we need to remember that Ryzom is a strange game and takes a while to "get" it. The key to any trial for any online game is to do one thing: get people hooked on the game... get them addicted to the point where they're willing to pay for it.

I happen to think, based on my own experience, that stopping people at 21 in every skill will be too short and too superficial a look at such a strange and unusual game, for people to get hooked. It will shorten the time the freeloaders spend on the island, but at what cost? How many hundreds of players are going to DL the trial, get to 21, say, "Meh, interesting but not worth my $$ to subscribe", and just uninstall it? As I have said repeatedly -- I would have been one of them.

So yes, the marketing expert who said a great way to get people to pay is to give them a taste and then say "pay for the full thing" is right, that technique works in principle. However in practice you need to figure out how much of a taste is enough. And what some of us on this thread (including me) are saying here is that 21 levels is not enough of a taste to hook most people, and we are also saying it would not have been enough of a taste to hook us.

If you think about it this is a compliment to Ryzom, actually -- because most games are so repetitive and limited that after about 10 minutes you an figure out the UI and the game, and everything in the later levels is just a repeat. A trial of COH would be fine to level 3 or 4 (out of 50), because you don't do anything appreciably different ever after that. The same would be true with GW, WOW, and most other games. Your new skills are just different animations, and everything else is the same in later levels as earlier -- the numbers just get bigger, and so on. But Ryzom is NOT like that. More skills mean more stanzas. More stanzas mean more customization. More customization means more uniqueness of character and often a complete change in how your abilities work (compare the harvester with +time, 3 sources, gentle stanzas, and specialization, vs. the one without those things). And by 21 I just do not think enough of this has presented itself to help the player who is used to those other simpler games, understand what Ryzom is all about, and how complex and interesting (and worthy of subscription) it really is.

Again let's realize no one is saying that Nevrax should provide an everlasting free experience to a bunch of freeloaders. We are saying that their choice of how to limit the game is not reasonable given the strangeness, uniqueness, and coolness of Ryzom, and the fact that it takes many levels (rather than many hours) in this game to understand what it is all about. We all agree the trial needs to have some restrictions placed on it more than what was being done before this patch... we just do not all agree that the one they chose, is the right one.

And some of us think it is so unbelievably wrong that they are going to lose hundreds of potential subscribers as a result.

C

[ummax]

Are you a active subsciber to any online game atm ?

yes

three actually the third one is this one which again i will state that I would not be active in or paying for at the level 21 cap. I'm beginning to think there is a comprehension problem here honestly or you have read exactly zero of any of the threads on this forum about this - one of the two -

[totnkopf]

yes

three actually the third one is this one which again i will state that I would not be active in or paying for at the level 21 cap. I'm beginning to think there is a comprehension problem here honestly or you have read exactly zero of any of the threads on this forum about this - one of the two -

You're saying you wouldn't buy the game with the current cap... Andarr said ok, we lose some with a cap, but in the process we limit the freeloaders and still retain the ability to sell the game to other players.
While you might not have subbed up, there will be others that do... sure, they're losing a few subs, but as Andarr pointed out, we don't want our sub money going into keeping freeloaders playing Ryzom. Considering the financial woes Nevrax has gone through in the past couple years, I'd much rather see a level cap and lose a few subs now and then, than continue to let the freeloaders run around Silan and continue to suck up cash (that cash coming from folks like yourself that would have subbed up after lvl 21).

So lose a sub from time to time (84 levels to decide if you like the game or not... thats a decent amount), but we've limited freeloaders, eased stress on the server and hopefully in the process allowed out sub money to go into the development of the game. Its a trial, you get a taste of what the game offers, not the whole meal.

[fiach]

Free trial up to 21 in numerous skills.

15 bucks to start full game.

Vs,

55 Bucks for a totally unknown quantity
1 month "free"

I know which I would choose, i temper this by saying that i have tried the other games looking for an alternative with the depth, community and beauty of Ryzom, unsucessfully I might add.

For all the freeloaders that reckon..."oh....Im really not sure about the game and dont know if i'm willing to invest 15 bucks"....

Christ if the price of 2 beers for a months excellent entertainment is such anathema to you, go play freeware or korean F2P games and leave your whingin crap on their forums (fora for the pedantic).

[ummax]

For all the freeloaders that reckon..."oh....Im really not sure about the game and dont know if i'm willing to invest 15 bucks"....

Christ if the price of 2 beers for a months excellent entertainment is such anathema to you, go play freeware or korean F2P games and leave your whingin crap on their forums (fora for the pedantic).

heh I know an lineage 2 player when I see's one

aren't you whining to the whiners?

(never understood what the shut up posts are for people complain about posts on a forum that players ingame were told to post to about an issue .. can't seem to please some people)

CSR's told us to post to the forums and not talk about it ingame. So here we have posts on a forum to discuss the issue and not talk about it in game.

YOu have the option of completely skipping the thread all together but trolling and making yourself look impatient and intollerant is not a great way to talk to the new PAYING subscribers of the community ... jus' sayin'

anyhow had enough of this its two VERY OBVIOUSLY different schools of thought here

I have not seen anything from nevrax that the reasons they did this to the trial period was due to costing them money or server bandwidth. (if this was the case the humungous download would be an issue to them as well) I see some people saying they dont want to pay for "freeloaders" I think most if not EVERY SINGLE person posting in this thread has agreed freeloaders are not a good thing

As previously stated our problem is not the issue of the freeloaders but the way in which the free trial was dealt with. Those who think the level cap of 21 was not a a good idea offer up the idea of a time limited trial.

ONe month or 30 days however you want to word it is enough for even a casual gamer due to the fact that the quests only take a couple of hours and cap you at 21 very quickly

Also the 60 bucks and 1 month free trial is pretty much the same as telling me to pay up and try for 3 months and quit if i hate it (especially true now)

neither is a good deal. The idea behind free trials is to hook a customer and customer retention. If you want me to try this game out and have no free trial the current new system is doing that.

Also it looks like its about 50% of those presently saying they would not have subscribed. For a small company trying to make money THAT IS A LOT

Things are changing and more and more games are moving to free software with digital download including SOE.

Anyhow its a competitive market if this game is to survive its got to keep up.

So anyhow when i see posts like this I wonder if the community I joined was such a hot one to start with. I know the atmosphere on the island was very good and the reason why I stayed. This is essentially being removed now. If i am paying at level 21 i'm going to want access to all skills and content and not be limited so will leave the island and it will now become a barren unwelcoming place.


Ah well such is life. GAmes that are wastelands when I login to often turn me away one of the things that impressed me most was the sheer number of players that were present in the starter area. (no not the universal channel heh i spoke mostly in the regional chat)

Anyhow "shut up" posts well hehe never sure why people post like that its a forum its where people exchange ideas just dont read it if it sucks that much and you wont be so irritated.

I've said enough about this and so have others. If I could bet you guys 10 bucks as to the effects on new subscriber number and the fact I think its gonna cause a huge drop I would. This is my prediction having seen the number of people who have moved to the mainland vs. the number ouf of that number who are saying they would not have moved with the new system. (its a lot trust me)

[moleclme]

What still seems to miss my mind is how exactly they're losing money on the freeloafers? If I know anything about running a server (as iIve previously worked on an mmo myself) extra players isn't going to cost you anything until the server turns unstable and eventually needs to be upgraded.

Neither can I fathom how these freeloafers need 'service'?
On to another part: Does anyone see any downside in having the max at level 30 instead? Almost everyone is saying: "I found out I wanted to play this game at level 25-30".

It's still way too low for people to freeloaf. Problem solved? or?

[totnkopf]

Things are changing and more and more games are moving to free software with digital download including SOE.

Anyhow its a competitive market if this game is to survive its got to keep up.

there is no charge for the game. When you download the trial, you're DLing the full game (hence it being so large). When you sub up, you're just paying to start your sub. In other words, the software is free and you essentially HAVE to download the game.

Try the SWG trial or the trials for quite a few other MMOs and you'll find very low level caps (SWGs is lvl 10 and you're restricted to a lame space station that shows you nothing of what outdoors or planets actually look like). Ryzom allows a player 84 levels of testing/experiencing and gives them a taste of what the game has to offer (the different looks of the lands, the different mobs, goo infected zones, NPCs, etc)

I could see them raising the lvl cap, but only to 29... that gives them quite a few extra levels to play around with, but also limits them from completing all the quests (only 1, I believe).

[telar]

Correct me if I´m wrong but weren´t there allready level caps ?
didn´d mats stop at level 50, could anyone make clothes above lvl 40
what about the exp one could get at level 50, so basicly by that time most people would have decided for them selfes if the game was one to play or not. I joined the game quite early but realy can understand the once wich take longer for their decision. This game is one of the more complicated difficult games I ever tried. And when I started it was still a 14 days trial, still I tought this was an excellent Idee of Nervax to change it to unlimited.
I still think it would have pulled more players onto the mainland especially the undecided, than level caps will do.

I personally would never try a game wich offers me no free trial, I did this once and that was a big mistake. And If I look at other games yes they do have restrictions but with most of those games , as some others allready have stated, one knew the Interface and gameplay with in a couple of hours.

My first char wich I moved onto the mainland I deleted, I got there far to early

[ummax]

[QUOTE=totnkopf]

Try the SWG trial or the trials for quite a few other MMOs and you'll find very low level caps (SWGs is lvl 10 and you're restricted to a lame space station that shows you nothing of what outdoors or planets actually look like). Ryzom allows a player 84 levels of testing/experiencing and gives them a taste of what the game has to offer (the different looks of the lands, the different mobs, goo infected zones, NPCs, etc)

[\QUOTE]

heh i did and didn't like it and left (however one must realize that i was someone who played the "original version of swg" for like 1.5 years or so till they started messing with it.. left at the CU) also i think using swg as a comparison is a mistake the game is dying they have like almost zero customer retention with their free trial and most people use it as an example of what not to do like say level 10 limited free trial ?

also using the 84 level thing doesn't work on me its an exaggeration its the first 21 levels of 5 or was it 4 areas which take about 2 hours to hit with the missions .. but i think that has been said already. And again it was past that point at which a lot of people decided that they liked the stuff. Also let me say that the casting abilities of my character are at level 24 for offensive and 26 for defensive and i will tell you right now I HATE the casters in this game based on those levels. One day I may make the effort to move into the 40's with those areas but I found what i wanted in the game with a mellee fighter and the foraging and crafting trees. So yeah if i wanted to be a caster I will tell you right now I do not like the casters based on what I have seen. (coincidentally that is just about at the level cap.. odd itn't it?)

[naratuul]

What still seems to miss my mind is how exactly they're losing money on the freeloafers? If I know anything about running a server (as iIve previously worked on an mmo myself) extra players isn't going to cost you anything until the server turns unstable and eventually needs to be upgraded.

Bandwidth costs money