Can we play too ?

[elvigy1]

EQ2's missions, zones, number of races,, graphic detail with Ryzoms setting? Where do I sign up? Seriously.

I often wonder if the people who talk about how bad EQ2 and WoW have actually played the games.

I played WoW for almost a year. There were only 4 races per side, 8 total with very little ability to adjust the look of your toon. The missions were well done for the most part, but only the first few in the starting areas even pretended to be plot-driven. After that, they were mostly either pure hunt/gather (go here, kill 30 of x mob and collect their toenails) or fedex quests. And the main point in doing them was to gain levels or gain new equipment or recipes for crafting. And speaking of crafting, there was, at the time I played, no real reason to craft armor or weapons. The phat lewt drops from bosses was far better than anything that could be crafted. Crafting was pretty much only good for food or potions.

There were a handful of quests that led to phat lewt too. They involved killing boss mobs to collect various things that could then be used to craft an item. I was working on a cap at the time I left.

My point being that endless quests to get better stuff or to gain more levels does not necessarily a great game make. It was fun for a while, but in the end the repetitive nature of it is boring.

"Oh, cool, after two weeks of grinding quest mobs I now have a cap that gives me +5 to Int. Guess I can throw away that +4 cap I had, since it was Bind on Equip and I can't sell it"

Graphics wise, I don't see much difference. I like the way Ryzom looks (in fact, I like it more than I liked EQ2).

Zoning in EQ2 was a pain. You couldn't even travel to different parts of the same city without a zone loading screen. So not sure how that is to the advantage of EQ2. WoW did not have that problem.

All in all, I liked WoW. As stated, I paid to play it for almost a year. But it really isn't a fair comparison to compare it (quest-driven, raiding end-game) to Ryzom (pure sandbox).

EQ2 I thought was just another version of WoW.

[geezas]

No, I can't use materials. I only have 2-handed melee leveled. So I would have to take the mats to a crafter. Once the crafter has it, they are going to charge me money to make what I need.

Probably not, most are happy to help out, if they ask dappers it's because they bought grind mats and need tp money

So to argue that I (or those who did not level crafting) can use mats is wrong. There is no reason why after 200 levels of fighting I should be given something I have to pay someone to make useful to me.

Writing this brought two questions to my mind.

1) If I get mats and it costs me 10 mil to make armor with them at a crafter, is the crafter going to put in their own money to make me my equipment? Or am I going to be forced to pay to use my reward? Is that honestly fair, that I spend 3 days fighting Kitin and have to fork over a ton of my money to use my reward?

2) If I give the crafter my mats to use to craft something for me, they will get xp from that. Why should someone who didn't do any of the work to get the reward get any benefit from it?

*cough* you know how much time and effort it takes to level a craft branch ? Since you obviously don't craft anything I think it would be best if you would not make assumptions about what crafters do or don't do. If you need a mace anytime I'll whack one together for you for free

[raynes]

*cough* you know how much time and effort it takes to level a craft branch ? Since you obviously don't craft anything I think it would be best if you would not make assumptions about what crafters do or don't do. If you need a mace anytime I'll whack one together for you for free

Actually I do. Don't make assumptions about what I know and don't know. I have been with the game just as long as you (possibly longer).

[raynes]

My point being that endless quests to get better stuff or to gain more levels does not necessarily a great game make. It was fun for a while, but in the end the repetitive nature of it is boring.

But having no quests where you are forced to go out and kill random animals to level does make a great game? Because lets get real here, that is EXACTLY what ryzom is. You want to get to level 250 melee, you have to go out everyday and kill things over and over and over. It is as if not more repetitive that doing quests to get xp.

[rothimar]

The issue is that quests/missions designed to give out "phat lewt" usually lead to a whole crap load of contested mobs, farming, camping issues, and "phat lewt" leads to market degradation, and unhappy crafters.

I would much prefer a version of the alternative you put forward which offers a "buff" to your skills, rather than an item that will harm crafting/economy. The key to working alternative rewards into a mission/mob is to give something that will not harm other players, and that cannot be used as a farm for loot/money.

This is where Nevrax should start looking to innovate. A rewards system which provides a benefit to players without taking away from other players. A system which doesn't suit farmers, but does inspire players to participate. This is an opportunity which can be used to give Ryzom a marketable, new, fresh perspective on a very stale and abused aspect of MMORPG gaming.

But having no quests where you are forced to go out and kill random animals to level does make a great game? Because lets get real here, that is EXACTLY what ryzom is. You want to get to level 250 melee, you have to go out everyday and kill things over and over and over. It is as if not more repetitive that doing quests to get xp.

[totnkopf]

Just let them fix the encyclopedia missions and allow those skills to be upgraded. things like the lightning aura for example. At the moment its pointless... it looks cool, its a neat little thing to have, but I don't have it on any of my hands bars because its pretty usless in combat.

Allow us to upgrade it through various entries in the encyclopedia and it could become a nice aura (not to mention it could allow for more lore to be IG).

Phat lewt is already in game in the form of NPC armors. Thats about as far as I'd like to see it go. The encyclopedia rewards have shown great potential so far (except that lame +5 map marker one...... ) we just need more of them and allow the existing ones to be upgraded.

[rothimar]

Replies below quotes...

Just let them fix the encyclopedia missions and allow those skills to be upgraded. things like the lightning aura for example. At the moment its pointless... it looks cool, its a neat little thing to have, but I don't have it on any of my hands bars because its pretty usless in combat.

Allow us to upgrade it through various entries in the encyclopedia and it could become a nice aura (not to mention it could allow for more lore to be IG).

I agree 110%

Phat lewt is already in game in the form of NPC armors. Thats about as far as I'd like to see it go.

I'm sure I'm not going to make any friends with this remark... but I say remove what "phat lewt" is already in game, and never add it back! *ducks*

I've never been a fan of loot rewards, and the more I consider doing some more crafting progression... the more I hate the idea of seeing it introduced any more than it already has. If Nevrax is going to take any pointers from other MMO's... it sure has **** should not be the BAD ones.

[elvigy1]

I see your point. I could argue that leveling in Ryzom by killing things is not required, since you could potentially be a crafter or harvester for your entire life here, whereas in WoW there really is no point in leveling only your crafting skill since you won't be able to make most of the high end stuff yourself.

But that's not really practical, since even in Ryzom you need a relatively high level of hp and survival skills to harvest the best mats.

I'll go back to my main point though, that Ryzom is a sandbox. If you don't feel like grinding on melee to get to a high level, then don't. Work on magic. Or crafting. Or harvesting.

In WoW there is not really much point to playing if you aren't shooting for the highest level, since most of the content is designed for rewards obtained by raiding at high levels. (Or PvP at high levels-but a lot of that is based more on how many hours a day you can sit at your keyboard playing in Alterac Valley or whatever and not so much on skill.)

[totnkopf]

I'm sure I'm not going to make any friends with this remark... but I say remove what "phat lewt" is already in game, and never add it back! *ducks*

I've never been a fan of loot rewards, and the more I consider doing some more crafting progression... the more I hate the idea of seeing it introduced any more than it already has. If Nevrax is going to take any pointers from other MMO's... it sure has **** should not be the BAD ones.

I don't like the way most games deal with phat lewt. SWG for example just made it something everyone can get by doing a mission. WoW has you earn some through honor points, etc. Ryzom did it in a way that I actually like. They made the boss that drops the gear almost impossible to kill. The revamped Aen was a challege and took a long while for people to figure out how to kill it. Now they're revamping them again, making them even harder. For loot thats "better than anything anyone can craft" (its not really... only the +hp/stam stats are btw... rest is average) it should be near impossible to get. And I think thats what Nevrax is aiming to do

[rothimar]

Well, hopefully they do keep up the whole "almost impossible to get" mentality for 'phat lewt'. I would much rather see innovation over copycat repetition of a flawed system, but as long as it doesn't harm crafting or the economy, I won't complain *as much* about it.

I don't like the way most games deal with phat lewt. SWG for example just made it something everyone can get by doing a mission. WoW has you earn some through honor points, etc. Ryzom did it in a way that I actually like. They made the boss that drops the gear almost impossible to kill. The revamped Aen was a challege and took a long while for people to figure out how to kill it. Now they're revamping them again, making them even harder. For loot thats "better than anything anyone can craft" (its not really... only the +hp/stam stats are btw... rest is average) it should be near impossible to get. And I think thats what Nevrax is aiming to do