Spires for Neutrals – a modest proposal

[thurgond]

Playing a neutral peacemaker on Atys is hard, but building a simulation of peacemaking is hard since there are few real world examples to simulate. Then again on a world with teleporters and wombai, the developers can just forget simulation and build in some game play so neutral peacemakers can be more than semi-safe bystanders to a FvF war.

Spires are intended to help their builders' faction to hold ground and give other as yet unspecified bonuses. Their main annoyance to neutrals is that they block teleportation by both the opposite faction and neutrals. Therefore, I propose to give the neutral side something to build that will counteract the spires teleportation block for neutrals: a mound (yin to the spire's yang).

The mounds would be build like the temples in episode 2 with normal foraged or quartered materials and standard crafting skills. Once build, the mound would allow non-PvP flagged neutrals to teleport into the zone or respawn there. The opposing faction still could not teleport into a zone with a spire and a mound. There would have to be a timer on the PvP flag to keep one side from teleporting in while neutral then turning on PvP.

The mounds would not keep the spire in that zone from counting as a link to adjacent zones. For every pair of mounds in both faction's zones with spires, the number of active spires (used for determine the spire's levels) is reduced by one for both sides.

Mounds would be built in unoccupied/inactive outposts sites. This would make the site relatively agro free and a completed mound would suppress PvP inside the boundaries of the outpost site.

Anyone could damage the mound by foraging (digging up the mound). Such foraging would only yield mission mats, nothing craftable or saleable. The mound could be repaired with foraging/crafting just as it was build.

We do not know what the victory conditions for FvF war will be, but for discussions sake lets assume it will be involve taking and holding territory with spires. Similarly, building enough mounds could force a truce or peace.

[acridiel]

Hey, great Idea!
Thumbsup

Acridiel

[rdfall]

Ingame, under the support tickets thingy, you can send in a suggestion, i strongly suggest you send it on to the Devs, maybe one day they'll actually have a look at those and implement it

[kaetemi]

Umm... Just destroy the faction's spire? It will be NEUTRAL then.
I don't see how you can call something a game if you are given all privileges.
Teleportation is a privilege, not a right.

"Neutral" CAN'T just be a faction, cause then they wouldn't be NEUTRAL anymore, they would just be a faction with the name "Neutral" (the way tryton does stuff, isn't neutral either.. he does exactly the same as kami and karavan, only he almost doesn't give anything to the homins).

[gwythion]

I dont actually understand why this is necessary at all. The information on Global Faction PvP does not state that neutrals will have no access to tps.

From the Global Faction notes:

"It is impossible to use TP tickets when their destination is an area owned by an opposing faction. It is possible to use TP tickets in neutral areas, areas controlled by one’s faction, or in capitals."

The opposing factions are Karavan and Kami. Neutrals oppose no one therefore unless this is a total misuse of the English language neutrals will have access to all tps that work at all no matter who claims ownership of the area.

[gwythion]

"Neutral" CAN'T just be a faction, cause then they wouldn't be NEUTRAL anymore, they would just be a faction with the name "Neutral" (the way tryton does stuff, isn't neutral either.. he does exactly the same as kami and karavan, only he almost doesn't give anything to the homins).

I quite agree about your comment regarding Tryton, he is in my eyes not neutral at all. I do not think that he is neutral in the D&D alignment sense either, he has his own agenda and it is not entirely clear what that is.

[carrie]

"Neutral" CAN'T just be a faction, cause then they wouldn't be NEUTRAL anymore, they would just be a faction with the name "Neutral" (the way tryton does stuff, isn't neutral either.. he does exactly the same as kami and karavan, only he almost doesn't give anything to the homins).

I completely agree with this. As a neutral player, I found the Tryton response of supporting whomever was the current underdog inadequate. Tryton proved himself to be an opportunist rather than neutral.

[achaz]

True Neutral

"Balancer"

Some neutral characters commit themselves philosophically to neutrality. They are of the true neutral alignment as described in Advanced Dungeons & Dragons.

A true neutral character sees good, evil, law, and chaos as prejudices and dangerous extremes. He advocates the middle way of neutrality as the best, most balanced road in the long run.

Some true neutral characters actively support balance in the world, and seek to avoid having any one side, law or chaos, good or evil, become too powerful over them or anyone else, and will work against whichever side is the most powerful. They tend to side with the underdog in any situation, and are often opportunistic in their actions.

True neutral is committed to the avoidance of extremes, and is non-judgmental.

Tryton is true neutral... as in a 'balancing' force. His actions fit perfectly. Anyway Just my 2 cents.

-Vanand

[acridiel]

I completely agree with this. As a neutral player, I found the Tryton response of supporting whomever was the current underdog inadequate. Tryton proved himself to be an opportunist rather than neutral.

Huhm.... Sorry to disagree on that, a truly neutral force does not stand by and watch as others kill themselve. It favores no one, it uses its influence, in this Game it´s "Manpower", to support the Equilbrium, the "neutral" state of things.
So it´s just that what Tryton does. We´ve bannged heads in Germany over that one for as long as Tryton is around here.
He´s not Switzerland, y´know?
Else, what sense would it make to even have him Ingame?
If he was just someone who said: "Watch them kill each other, let "the Gods" sort em out and lean back while they´re at it." And you were one of his "folowers" what would you do?
Okay, you would do what you always do InGame. Just no PvP/FvF.
But, well... Why then have him Ingame? Just to have someone for the players to look up to? To show them "how to sit back an do nothing in case of Conflickt?"
Sorry, that would make no sense at all.
I know I will probaly start a new Flame War with this question, but:
What would you have him do?
He speaks up for peace.
He says, not in this words mind you, : "Atys for the People".
He says, the "Gods" use you for their own means, so take Action against it.

I sometimes thing he´s supposed to say: "Okay, so these Gods are using you Homins. Well, tough Luck, nothing you can do about it. Just sit back and watch the show as those who support these gods tear each other appart. Oh, and while you´re at it, fetch me a new Drink and then go and kill some Ocyx. And when their´re finished with their war, we all be good Homins again and retunr to our non-agressive slavery."

That would be neutral in the sense many people are understandig it, it seems to me. But, well... That´s not what these Games are for, y´know?

Anyone who wants to do that, may do that and DOES do that, I did it myself.
Got 8 Honor Points for rezzing people when I once helped my guild down there. Wow... I´m a "Killer".
But Nevrax just can´t ignore those Players who don´t like either Side of the Coin but actually wants join the "Fun" of PvP/Fvf, so Elias Tryton.
That´s just it.

So, open fire all those who want to be left alone by war.
As it was said: The Feather is mightier than the sword.
Go ahead, "kill" me. I´ve said what I wanted to say.

Acridiel

[forever]

Neutrals are ones who do not side with any party in a war or dispute. If you give them a task in the war they are no longer neutral.
I'm not apposed to having a third faction but it would not be called Neutrality.
I also do not see Tryton as being neutral because be got Homins involved in the war, if he was truly neutral he would tell Homins to stay out of the war and try to go about their lives as best they could.