ranged needs to be fixed.

[aylwyne]

Yea... things like todays change with the DP timer tickdown from 3 days to 20 days was really important. Fixing the description for +hitrate bricks and a couple ranged crafting titles were pretty damn pressing issues... I agree.

It's amazing that someone can even try to defend nevrax on this issue.

It's not like this is some major patch. This is just a minor patch to address a few small bugs that they could push live without a lot of fuss. A major rework of range combat is in a total different category of fix. That's the kind of thing that will involve a much larger patch and more extensive testing.

In general at a software company, there's two separate groups of developers working on a project. There's the core development team in charge of new features and major upgrades and a sustaining team that's responsible for minor bug fixes and tweaks. This is because if you had your core developers always fixing bugs, they'd never get anything else done and we'd never have new features.

Today's patch was likely a result of the sustaining team. It was a compilation of several minor bugs they've fixed over the past couple of weeks. Meanwhile, the core developers are probably working on new features and major upgrades which we'll see in the future. Perhaps one of these is range, perhaps not.

[tetra]

It's not like this is some major patch. This is just a minor patch to address a few small bugs that they could push live without a lot of fuss. A major rework of range combat is in a total different category of fix. That's the kind of thing that will involve a much larger patch and more extensive testing.

Lets see here

December 9, 2004 : Major Patch Preview
Major Patch Preview:

There will be a major patch on December 14th. This patch provides a number of improvements to the game and introduces the first of the three sets of Chapter 2 features.

The patch highlights include :
- A first set of improvements to range combat

The first fix, was a god ****** brick/stanza from beta... complete with the missing description code that it had in beta. This brick/stanza was put in game on the live servers even though there was not one single post saying it benefitted ranged combat, and a great deal of them in the ATS forums saying that it harmed ranged combat. Even better, is that when the brick was removed during beta due to the base speed of melee weapons being removed, they ignored posts saying that they forgot to do the same with ranged weapons...

And you expect me to believe that they are working hard to find the exact perfect balance and proper coding to fix it? I was born at night, but it was not last night.

[josephm]

Not to mention benchmarking. It's a business like any other. WoW has something like this and Wish does to. It was a simple thing to implement compared to the revamp of an entire system and showed that while 'original' Nevrax can take the ideas of others and implement them in a different manner that fits their format.

Remember DP while off was bugged? notice how fast it was fixed? I don't think it was that difficult to implement.

[tetra]

Not to mention benchmarking. It's a business like any other. WoW has something like this and Wish does to. It was a simple thing to implement compared to the revamp of an entire system and showed that while 'original' Nevrax can take the ideas of others and implement them in a different manner that fits their format.

Remember DP while off was bugged? notice how fast it was fixed? I don't think it was that difficult to implement.

It's funny how I can mention to a gm that framerate effects runspeed and lower framerates make you run slower. It's funny how I can give him all sorts of information about this, and then a couple days later we can get a patch that slows you down closer to the slowest speed you normally run when you turn off some of the various settings that slowed you down when they are on. Of course it takes several months to even consider fixing ranged.

[aylwyne]

I was born at night, but it was not last night.

However long ago you were born, you don't seem to really understand how things work at a software development company.

Fact of the matter is, no matter how much one person whines, that doesn't make it a hot issue. Would it be nice if range worked better than it does? Yes. Is it more important than them working to get rites and content fixed and get this game's story moving forward? No.

You can disagree all you want but in the big picture, getting the content of the game introduced will go much further towards the popularity of the game than fixing range.

I certainly hope the main development team is working on storyline content (which from the last couple of patches it appears they are) and are not focusing on range right now. If they can get any minor adjustments to range done, that's just gravy.

[josephm]

However long ago you were born, you don't seem to really understand how things work at a software development company.

Fact of the matter is, no matter how much one person whines, that doesn't make it a hot issue. Would it be nice if range worked better than it does? Yes. Is it more important than them working to get rites and content fixed and get this game's story moving forward? No.

You can disagree all you want but in the big picture, getting the content of the game introduced will go much further towards the popularity of the game than fixing range.

I certainly hope the main development team is working on storyline content (which from the last couple of patches it appears they are) and are not focusing on range right now. If they can get any minor adjustments to range done, that's just gravy.

Word. hey I really like your website! everyone check it out!

[foreverb]

Just some fun numbers for you all.


The max damage on a pike is 2*Level+52.
The max damage on a rifle is 1.3*level+56.
The max damage on a lance is 1.66*level.
The max damage on a launcher is 6*level+156.

A choice pike with max damage will have 21/min attacks.
A choice rifle with max speed will have 17/min attacks.
A choice lance with max damage will have 29/min attacks.
A choice Launcher with max speed will have 8/min attacks.

---------Damage---damage/min----with Increased damage stanza for melee only.
Level 10
Pike_______72______1512______3024
Rifle_______69______1173
Lance______16______464_______928
Launcher___216_____1728

Level 50
Pike_______152______3192______6384
Rifle_______121______2057
Lance______83______2407_______4814
Launcher___456_____3648

Level 100
Pike_______252______5292______10584
Rifle_______186______3162
Lance______166______4814_______9628
Launcher___756_____6048

Level 150
Pike_______352______7392______14784
Rifle_______251______4267
Lance______249______7221_______14442
Launcher___1056_____8448

Level 200
Pike_______452______9492______18984
Rifle_______316______5372
Lance______332______9628_______19256
Launcher___1356_____10848

Level 250
Pike_______552______11592______23184
Rifle_______381______6477
Lance______415______12035_______24070
Launcher___1656_____13248

I can craft all 4 of these items and the equasions work at all levels of the items. Atleast up to 200 pikes, 110 launcher ammo, 110 rifle ammo, and 170 lances. But i'd very much assume its a linear formula thats used for weapon damages.


If anyone can post the base damages for spells of each spell level that'd be great. Keep in mind that these numbers could easly be compared to a caster with a 96% amp since these are MAX damage numbers for these weapons.

[tetra]

If anyone can post the base damages for spells of each spell level that'd be great. Keep in mind that these numbers could easly be compared to a caster with a 96% amp since these are MAX damage numbers for these weapons.

acid (they are all the same except for level 1/2)
Level 1: 15, 3 credit brick. Learn at level 0
Level 2: 45, 15 credit brick. Learn at level 10
Level 3: 90, 30 credit brick. Learn at level 20
Level 4: 120, 40 credit brick. Learn at level 30
Level 5: 150, 50 credit brick. Learn at level 45
Level 6: 195, 65 credit brick. Learn at level 55
Level 7: 240, 80 credit brick. Learn at level 70
Level 8: 300, 100 credit brick. Learn at level 85
Level 9: 360, 120 credit brick. Learn at level 105
Level 10: 420, 140 credit brick. Learn at level 125
Level 11: 480, 160 credit brick. Learn at level 145
Level 12: 540, 180 credit brick. Learn at level 165
Level 13: 600, 200 credit brick. Learn at level 185

Don't forget, after level 100 you can use them on dual nukes.

[xenofur]

you also forgot to include the time you can use these things and the downtime needed until you can use them again
simple damage output isn't the only matter here

[xenoarch]

you also forgot to include the time you can use these things and the downtime needed until you can use them again
simple damage output isn't the only matter here

well damage output/range is fine for the fact you can run while shooting (though rifles and bow rifles could use a better range) in my mind balances that part out

the real issue is the cost/bulk of ammo. simple solution. make the cost and bulk of the ammo 1/5 current. So for 4 mats you get 200 pistol shots, and 6 mats gets 100 bowrifle shots. This will allow for ranged users to survive off quartering. THough it will make it even tougher to craft there own ammo from just your own usage (its tough to do that without grinding). But would open a better market as ranged folx will have a much less downtime, and make it so that you can get away with not having to harvest for ammo.

also will have to make the clip size 5x bigger otherweise there is database issues to deal with.

though maybe only make it 2x or 3x for the launchers

that should be the fix first then they can work on specials for range. THough this is just a gut feeling, havent ran the numbers. (I used to be a game developer and balance was my cup of tea) I'll come up with a better rework in a week or so and try to get it noticed by the devs.

I've only played ranged for 4 days and I'm 27 ranged fight, 24 ranged craft, 52 harvester.. i did not want to be a harvester (though can't complain about the money) those numbers just not right.. I'm having fun cept when i harvest.